PAF = bright?

[anewdefguitarist]

ive really been digging the '59 sound lately. but how much bottom end does it bring to the fight? would the C5 be a better choice? im trying to add that vintage growl but i really need the bottom to be reinforced. is it safe to say that all vintage/moderate output pickups are voiced pretty bright?? how about the air zone? i know its suppose to sound a little vintage and its eq'd with a lot of bass and mids...however, like i said, i really like the growl the '59 gives. i cant really describe what im hearing, i just like how the 59 sounds...i was almost dead set on a rio grande BBQ but im afraid it will be too smooth. i really dont want a smooth pickup...i want growling and spitting with decent bite and tight bottom. please help...

[Zhangliqun]

The C5 is basically a hotter, louder 59. Some complain that the C5 is a little thin in the midrange and I tend to agree. If that turns out to be the case with you, go with the Custom -- basically the same as the C5 but with a ceramic mag instead of A5. More mids and tighter lows by most accounts.

EDIT: Not all vintage-voiced PAF-clone pu's are bright -- the Seth Lover and the Antiquities are pretty smooth, as is the Alnico 2 Pro.

[Lewguitar]

The C5 is basically a hotter, louder 59. Some complain that the C5 is a little thin in the midrange and I tend to agree. If that turns out to be the case with you, go with the Custom -- basically the same as the C5 but with a ceramic mag instead of A5. More mids and tighter lows by most accounts.

EDIT: Not all vintage-voiced PAF-clone pu's are bright -- the Seth Lover and the Antiquities are pretty smooth, as is the Alnico 2 Pro.

That was the case with me after trying the C5 for a few months and feeling that I wanted to hear more mids and less bite. So after trying the Custom Custom I finally settled on the Duncan Custom and the Custom is now my favorite bridge humbucker.

But regarding the 59B, it's been a favorite of mine for many years and I have a Strat set up with the 59B as the bridge pickup and it sounds killer. I had a beautiful PRS for a while but everytime I'd compare it to my Strat with the 59B it was no contest and I eventually sold the PRS.

The 59B has good mids...strong tight bass and toothy treble. It's the pickup I go to when I want to nail Clapton's Wheels of Fire tone or the tone of his SG that he played with Cream. It's also great (through a Marshall) for early EVH tone.

Lew

[Jeff5]

That was the case with me after trying the C5 for a few months and feeling that I wanted to hear more mids and less bite. So after trying the Custom Custom I finally settled on the Duncan Custom and the Custom is now my favorite bridge humbucker.

What's funny Lew is that I basically arrived at the same conclusion recently. The Custom was my first SD, now I'm using it again.

[drew_half_empty]

'59s have PLENTY of bass response

however from my expirience most all PAF's have kind of a loose bottom to them

[anewdefguitarist]

how much of my recto could it handle? would i have to play on the vintage setting or back the gain way off? i dont play with too much gain as it is...i deffinately need that bottom end like i said, so would the air zone be a better choice? i think that 'mojo' i talked about is just that scooped middle. i really like it in the 59. the C5 clip is terrible and i dont really get **** outta that...i like the scooped aggression i guess, but i also need that body in there. am i asking for too much? any others that would fit the bill? how bout the patb-3??

[the guy who invented fire]

How much of what could youre recto handle??

Also, I have to mention...if you are talking about those acrylic guitars nopne of these rules of thumb will work right...the tonal difference between wood and plastic, acrylic, lucite, plexiglass, aluminum, kevlar, graphite, etc...anything thats NOT wood will change the tone WAY more than you think...

[anewdefguitarist]

How much of what could youre recto handle??

Also, I have to mention...if you are talking about those acrylic guitars nopne of these rules of thumb will work right...the tonal difference between wood and plastic, acrylic, lucite, plexiglass, aluminum, kevlar, graphite, etc...anything thats NOT wood will change the tone WAY more than you think...

how much of my mesa could the 59 handle? ive never had a PAF pickup before and i just wanted to know if the amp would completely over-power the pickup and turn it into hissing...and i actually am talking about those acrylics...do you think the 59 would help? i wanted to give them a vintage snarl but ****...im so tired of this **** i about dont want to do anything with them anymore. they look pretty ****in sweet i just wish they would sound a little better. i never say that im searching for pickups to beter the acryllics because i can never get a good opinion other than "sell them they're ****"...well im sorry, but ive heard ****ty 200$ no name knock-offs that ARE made of wood and sound a whole hell of a lot worse than these came STOCK!! i just want an unbiased answer is all. im afraid if i say right off the bat "these are for my acrylics" then no one will answer. so, would the 59's help my acrylics out?

[JB_From_Hell]

The Air Zone is NOT vintagey in the least. It's billed as a "vintage output Tone Zone." Both are sweet pickups, but if you're after PAF-tone, stay away.

The DiMarzio Air Classic is a sweet PAF, and handles high gain very well. The Duncan '59 is pretty awesome, too.

If you have a few thousand disposable dollars, I'll hook ya up with a real set

[Kivitel]

My recto couldn't handle all that mexican food!

[pstarove]

From what I've heard, acrylic guitars have a very sharp, glassy top end. So paired with a '59 that is also very sharp, you better wear eyes protection! I suggest that you go for an Alnico II set, or a AIIP neck, CustomCustom bridge. I think they will complement acrylic better.

[Robert Delahunt]

ive really been digging the '59 sound lately. but how much bottom end does it bring to the fight? would the C5 be a better choice? im trying to add that vintage growl but i really need the bottom to be reinforced. is it safe to say that all vintage/moderate output pickups are voiced pretty bright?? how about the air zone? i know its suppose to sound a little vintage and its eq'd with a lot of bass and mids...however, like i said, i really like the growl the '59 gives. i cant really describe what im hearing, i just like how the 59 sounds...i was almost dead set on a rio grande BBQ but im afraid it will be too smooth. i really dont want a smooth pickup...i want growling and spitting with decent bite and tight bottom. please help...

As for bottom end, I own a '59 neck, and it's got bass, but I've never tried it in the bridge. But most PAFs that I've played in Les Pauls seem to have lots of bass yet not enough highs for me, at least the mahogany body ones. Now simply switch woods to Swamp Ash (the Les Paul Swamp Ash special) and it's got plenty brights for me. As for moderate output, the Pearly Gates Plus is what I have in my Showmaster, and it's got lots of mids, good lows, and decent brights (so in a different wood other than basswood it will probably have less mids, but still enough). As for growling and spitting, the Pearly Gates and Pearly Gates Plus should both cover this (but I've only experienced the PG+), and the JB that I owned also would have plenty of growl. I feel inadequately experienced to recommend anything other than PG+ or JB, but I've played enough Les Pauls.

[drew_half_empty]

a '59 could 'handle' the mesa, of course depending on your settings, but they keep their articulation pretty well for humbuckers

but yeah i know nothing about lucite guitars

[the guy who invented fire]

I don't think you'll have any problems with the 59's (or any other pickup to be honest) and the Mesa...now ont he issue of the guitars, Imnot saying that you'll never get a good sound what I am saying is that 99.9% of people don't play non wooden guitars so if you ask someone about their pickup choises and take what they say to heart and then try the same pickups in your guitars don't expect the same result...you'll get similar results but the tone will be different.

Now, if you buy new Duncans you have a 21 day exchange option and IMO oyu can't beat that! The best advise I can give you is to get a set of pickups, try them and see for yourself...FWIW, inmy experience with lucite and plexiglass guitars they tend to have a VERY dense bottom, a very defined (but sharp) midrange and a very odd (not bad, just different) top end responce...newck pickups that might work well would be (IMO of course) 59's and Alnico II Pro's, when you get to the bridge pickup I would go form somethng hotter and if it were me I'd try a Custom or a JB.

Good luck!

[walt]

If you are looking at PAF style pickups, I would highly recommend the VHPaf and swap the magnet with an A2. This pickup rocks in my strat and this strat has had a 59, JB, Custom, CC, C5, Pearly Gates, Air Zone, ToneZone, Norton, and Super D and the VHPaf is much better than the others I've tried imho. Very versitale, open sounding pickup.

[anewdefguitarist]

If you are looking at PAF style pickups, I would highly recommend the VHPaf and swap the magnet with an A2. This pickup rocks in my strat and this strat has had a 59, JB, Custom, CC, C5, Pearly Gates, Air Zone, ToneZone, Norton, and Super D and the VHPaf is much better than the others I've tried imho. Very versitale, open sounding pickup.

speakin of dimarzio's, anybody know what vai uses in his new acryllic ibanez? i saw an add in Guitar one or something that said it was a special pickup but i cant find anything on it...

[BRHGM]

I agree with Lew, sounds like you want a Custom. I have one in the bridge of my Steinberger. I also like the 59n in the bridge of my Tele. IT has plenty of bottom and goes from vintage to biting sound. Think Mick Mars with a lot of distorion and Clapton with tone rolled back. The C5 is a 59 on steroids and the CC is an APH on steroids. The BBQ is much crunchier and won't clean up the same as the Custom or the 59.

[anewdefguitarist]

thank you guys for these suggestions and putting up with my acryllic questions. i really hate to get rid of them as they're really like a part of me now. i've had them for about 4 years and people still come up and say "are you the guy with the clear guitars?" i've just recently started to "grow up" and our band is starting to take off a little more than any of us thought (not hoped, but thought) and i dont want to sound rinky dink, i want to sound the best that we can.

ive really been diggin that vintage crunch lately. i dunno, it just is really connecting with me right now for some reason. i kinda want like a george thorogood on steroids kinda thing outta those guitars. and guy who invented fire, you're **** right about your description of their sound -

"...FWIW, inmy experience with lucite and plexiglass guitars they tend to have a VERY dense bottom, a very defined (but sharp) midrange and a very odd (not bad, just different) top end responce..."

thats about the best iv'e heard it described. everything just seems a little "dense" very "blunt" sounding...it doesnt' have really a touch of anything, its like everything wants to jump out at you. having an all tube nice amp really made a difference too. you can't imagine how it sounded through SS amps. ssshhhrrriiiillll. so anyways, thanks all for the wisdom guys. hopefully i can pull them **** trigger soon and get some stuff put in to these babies and see what happens. if nothin works you may see one on the trading post, lol. thanks again.

have a good one

[anewdefguitarist]

so i guess my initial question are PAF's generally brighter toned/voiced? or should i go for a modern style pickup?

[pstarove]

There are a lot of PAFs, some are bright like the '59s and Burstbucker Pros, others are smoother and mellower (like A2Ps), '57 Classic/Classic Plus. IMHO for a composite material guitar like acrylic, Alnico2 magnets are the must.

I have a similar experience with a graphite necked Steinberger GSX. I tried a lot of pickups in it, everything sounded too hi-fi. Only the A2 Burstbuckers helped to tame that. But the guitar is still a little too bright, I think '57 Classics would be a better choice for it.

For your guitar I recommend any of those pickups: SD Antiquities, Alnico II Pros, Gibson '57Classic/Classic Plus. If you want a more modern, higher gain sound, the Custom Custom will be a good choice for the bridge, although I think '57Classic Plus has more than enough output.