NASA conspiracy theory cool Sh!T

[tone?]

Today's plans to go back are to a large part fueled by the fact that the moon would make a much better staging area for missions to other planets.

And they didnt know that 40 years ago??

And why are all other countries in the world wanting to go there now????

just seems a bit odd to me thats all.

[uOpt]

And they didnt know that 40 years ago??

And why are all other countries in the world wanting to go there now????

just seems a bit odd to me thats all.

It's a pissing contest.

People realize that the original space race boosted American capabilities. Not from bringing some rocks home. Because of the mindset that it put America and Americans in. To do well on today's Earth people need motivation, and a project like this, even is useless motivates large parts of the important sections of your society.

Also, I mentioned this before, but the 40 year pause wasn't planned. Somebody had the idea to make reusable space vehicles. The Space Shuttle was the result. The Shuttle was a disaster through and through, it basically dominated all the budget and brought us none of the capabilities that we hoped for, and a lot less total lift for the last decades. It was a colossal mistake and is to a major part responsible for us fooling around near Earth getting nothing done.

The Moon as a staging area to go to other destinations, namely Mars, isn't far-fetched at all. The Earth's atmosphere is a huge problem for space travel, and the gravity literally sucks too much.

[tone?]

Uopt, bro, i dig your quick responses and you do have some REAL valid points. Dont you think though that you are a bit too sure of all your answers though?

no offense eh?

[uOpt]

Uopt, bro, i dig your quick responses and you do have some REAL valid points. Dont you think though that you are a bit too sure of all your answers though?

no offense eh?

Sure about what?

I'm not the one who made up specific claims about radiation levels on the Moon without any data whatsoever.

Missing data to the contrary I go with the eyewitnesses.

[Sludgenutz]

I do have to say though. It seems very, very very strange that we didnt go again in 40 YEARS! and neither did the Soviets. You would think that they would go after we did. Especially after so many years that technology advanced as well.

"Strangeness" does not enter the equation. The USA won the gold medal! We beat the Soviets to a fine powder over and over for the greatest prize in all of humanity at the time. Much of the goal was to demonstrate that capitalism and Judeo-Christian values were a superior way for humanity, in contrast to the godless and authoritarian ways of the Soviets. <Not my strict personal view, just the national feeling. This is not meant to be a point of present contention.

There was no reason for the Soviets to go to the Moon with a manned mission after the successful Apollo program. The USA won the gold medal over and over, and a silver medal would have signified to the world that the Soviets were second best. They wanted the gold medal. They failed.

From a sociology and technology standpoint, there are certain projects and goals in human history, that are ripe for the time. Sometimes, there are are no do-overs, or second chances.

[daemon barbeque]

Soviets indeed watched the moon landing and they see the landing eagle . But noone saw the astronauts or the flag etc. Soviets build too many crap to open their mouths. They actually won the race, since they where the first once ot in space. But they lost too many good astronauts. They wouldn't say any words about "loseing the race", since they tried to cover up their own mass this way.It was a big fiasco what Russians had, and they used US to cover up their own fiasco.

The Radiation on moon is "not lethal"? Well, Soviet Russia couldn't even calculate the right landing/docking angle, how do they want to be right about the radiation? Soviets never give a crap about human resources, and wouldn't mind send people to death, as they did in WWII or somehwere else.
Don't believe in my words and read what NASA says about the moon radiation.
Really, you still try to ignore the NASA's own findings abaout the "lethal" Neutrons, and why they want to go back first in 2020. It's not the money, it's the lack of technology!

BTW, it's very UnAmerican to go first to the moon, ram the flag in but don't claim the land! Or build a base.It's the most strategic place to keep! If they where 6 times there, why no achievements. Many big holes in the whole story to believe.I won't!

[Arkitkt]

...lots of nonsense

So, you actually believe that

1. NASA flew to the moon 6 times without anyone on board.
2. The Russians knew about that all along and
3. Chose to keep quiet, thereby giving their bitter rivals the biggest propaganda success possible "just to cover up their own mess"?

Is that really what you're trying to say here??

BTW - The Russians were the first ones to achieve a soft landing on the moon (one of the "Luna" probes). They were also the first ones to successfully dock two spacecraft together (Soyuz 4 and 5 in January 1969).

And it would have been very un-American to waste money on a program after the main objective had been achieved.

[newking70]

Who were the German scientists that helped the Russians?

[Arkitkt]

Who were the German scientists that helped the Russians?

Don't know. NASA had the better Germans.

[uOpt]

Who were the German scientists that helped the Russians?

They only got a small minority since most of the Peenemünde crew walked to surrender to the Americans in time.

The Soviet space program was actually dominated by Soviet scientists with their Germans only playing supporting roles and serving as "fact-checker". The Soviets would run things they want to do by them and the Germans would say "nah we tried that and it blew up".

The Soviet space program did not even closely produce a system that would bring people to the Moon. They never had a rocket with enough stages and they never developed any form of lunar lander (a system that would land in a position that would allow it to go back up). By the time the U.S. was flying to the Moon the Soviets were actually bluffing trying to give an impression they had more advanced things than they historically did. Kind of dumb since it made the U.S. demonstrate their technological advantage even stronger.

It is worth noting that what the Soviets came up with was pretty solid. There is a contigugous line of Soyuz capsules (their third generation of capsules) that are used to this day. The ISS has at any point in time two of these basically 1960ties things attached for emergencies.

[idsnowdog]

Who were the German scientists that helped the Russians?

There were German scientists in the Russian program as well as the American program. However it would be a mistake to assume that since Germany had the lead in rocket research in WWII that the Russian space program was built entirely off German expertise.

If you had to characterize the two programs the Russians had the lead in logistics, pioneering achievements and number of space flights. The Americans had the technological edge and won the public relations races that mattered most.

CIA document on German scientists in USSR after WWII https://www.cia.gov/library/center-f...lear_Scent.pdf.

[daemon barbeque]

So, you actually believe that

1. NASA flew to the moon 6 times without anyone on board.
2. The Russians knew about that all along and
3. Chose to keep quiet, thereby giving their bitter rivals the biggest propaganda success possible "just to cover up their own mess"?

Is that really what you're trying to say here??

BTW - The Russians were the first ones to achieve a soft landing on the moon (one of the "Luna" probes). They were also the first ones to successfully dock two spacecraft together (Soyuz 4 and 5 in January 1969).

And it would have been very un-American to waste money on a program after the main objective had been achieved.

No, I believe that Soviets just kept their mouths shut to leave their blamished Lunar Landing adventure!

BTW, Russian Schools still don't teach the lunar landing as a fact!

[tone?]

Who were the German scientists that helped the Russians?

Wait a sec guys. Actually NASA was INITIATED BY FORMER MEMBERS OF NAZI GERMANY. one of the most prominent being Von Braun prestigious member of the SS. Look at my earlier posts in this thread.

The Soviets were WAY ahead of the US that is why the US wanted to land on the Moon. Now if the US actually landed there is another story. I can believe stuff from both sides. But it would be pretty tough to hide something of that magnitude. that is what logic would conclude. at least in my eyes. but there are some very valid arguments here.

I think the whole point is to have an open mind and learn something from all this because there are some VERY interesting points made from all parties here..

[Sludgenutz]

I suppose there will be people who claim the A-bombs were a hoax too.

[Redmist]

No, just those who try to point out that the first moon landing was a fake, all be it to blind eyes and deaf ears.
Such is the way it must be.

[Sludgenutz]

No, just those who try to point out that the first moon landing was a fake, all be it to blind eyes and deaf ears.
Such is the way it must be.

Cheers!

[Arkitkt]

The problem with conspiracy theorists is that, no matter how good the evidence to prove them wrong is, they still choose to believe in their conspiracies.
If the probe that currently orbits the moon shoots high-resolution images from the landing sites with the footsteps and Alan Shepard's golf balls, they will still believe that these were either put there by robots or that the new pictures are just as much fakes as the old ones.

And even if you managed to put these folks in a capsule, shoot them to the moon and bring them back, they would still believe that it was all staged.

So, why bother?

[Sludgenutz]

Do the hoaxers at least have a location/soundstage/stage props, etc. to at least throw off the truth? It shouldn't be too hard to fabricate a story. I mean, we all know it is gonna be found on planet Earth!

[firebirdV]

So, why bother?

Exactly.

[Sludgenutz]

Hear me out hoaxers:

US health care is not a cradle to grave program for the masses. Some people in the government, military, and private sector earn what is considered (by some, even a majority) obscene amounts of privilege. So be it, for this discussion.

Consider this: All health care programs on the planet have no limits for the "important" like JFK, and Teddy Kennedy in the twilight of his life...but rank and file employees numbering in the tens of thousands of people who worked for NASA, are at the mercy of a bureaucracy for health care.

Think of a loved one needing health care. Do all the hoaxers think that tens of thousands of people are gonna shut their mouths to the grave, rather than tell the truth to a media outlet for the life-saving cash?

Hoaxers need to get a grip.