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Thread: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

  1. #21
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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    That's vibrato, not tremelo. A lot of guitarists are seriously confused about the difference, apparently not knowing the difference between pitch & volume changes.

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    Super Toneologist oilpit's Avatar
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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    You are correct, but the vast majority of people call vibrato tremolo...
    So we assumed that's what you meant...

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    Quote Originally Posted by evhguitars View Post
    I think he does not know what he is talkin' bout?
    After some of the nonsense you've said you perhaps should have anticipated some return snark, troll.

    Quote Originally Posted by evhguitars View Post
    The other things are the JB was a PAF..so was EVH's a PAF they just were simply rewound.
    A radically rewound PAF isn't a PAF anymore. That's like using an SH-6 for a project and calling it a Distortion after rewinding it with 2K of 42AWG per coil. Good luck using that "monster" for metal.

    Quote Originally Posted by evhguitars View Post
    Also, the tele probably had 250k pots and different bleed kits than what EVH was using with a 500k pot..but they could be the same style pups.
    A JB tends to be terribly harsh & bright with 500K pots. Another reason to believe there's no chance of it having been a JB.

    My guitar's had a JB for 15 years, how about yours?

  4. #24
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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    Back to more serious discussion...

    Quote Originally Posted by ledvedder View Post
    I've heard that the pickups used in EVH's 1984/5150 Kramers where a JB/59 hybrid.
    First time I heard mention of a JB/59 hybrid was in the custom/59 hybrid DIY thread. And it was quickly dismissed as not sounding right by EVH fans. I don't know why it keeps popping up in discussions. Someone misremembering from that thread, maybe? If you can remember where you heard it mentioned, I'm curious.

    The clips I've heard of people playing the custom/59 hybrids can come eerily close to EVH's whammy lead tones. The bass/lower mids are closer, and the broader range of harmonics, and the lower mid/treble balance. And many of them were testing in floyded ash guitars with maple neck & fretboard, for non-Apples-to-Pineapples comparisons...

    The reason I have trouble believing he recorded much with a JB (you could probably find a live show he did or something, but you could probably find an old live show where he used almost any humbucker available at the time) is it's focused resonant peak. The harmonics EVH gets are very broad, which you tend to see more in either much less hot pickups, or in mismatched winds. Which is why the '78 has one coil significantly overwound.
    Last edited by Despair; 03-01-2010 at 02:33 PM. Reason: contorted phrasing fix

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    Quote Originally Posted by oilpit View Post
    You are correct, but the vast majority of people call vibrato tremolo...
    So we assumed that's what you meant...
    Even Leo called it a tremelo..

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    Quote Originally Posted by Despair View Post
    My guitar's had a JB for 15 years, how about yours?
    Little over 30 years!

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    Quote Originally Posted by Despair View Post
    A JB tends to be terribly harsh & bright with 500K pots.
    Hmmm..Wonder why the early ones were mainly put on guitars with 500K pots?
    Last edited by evhguitars; 03-01-2010 at 03:13 PM.

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    ... Brad Gillis used a JB in the red Strat before he switched it to a PJ Marx.

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    In an interview Eddie said that the 5150 Kramer had a SD 59, and then that he had Seymour wind him a "Custom" pickup. I'm gonna assume that he would be referring to the Custom Custom- as that pickup is a Floyd equipt strat guitar is the 80s VH sound.
    2001 Les Paul Classic (Custom/ 59n)
    2005 Les Paul Standard (Custom/R496)
    2006 PRS McCarty (HFS/McCarty Bass)
    Charvel Journeyman (JB)
    EVH 5150 III
    Mesa Recto 412 cab


    Technique can be either your boss or your b*tch.

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses


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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    ... the EMG 85s on the Steinberger are compressed and squishy w/ little or no bite. So I can see why he moved the bridge EMG to butt up against the TransTrem...

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    Quote Originally Posted by YHWH View Post
    ... the EMG 85s on the Steinberger are compressed and squishy w/ little or no bite. So I can see why he moved the bridge EMG to butt up against the TransTrem...
    True.

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    Jumping back to the JB thing, I really don't see why people are so vehemently opposed to the idea of EVH having used one. I have hear JBs quite a bit and I would not be surprised in the slightest if he had used them, especially his older sounds...lots of high end and midrange and somewhat spongy bass. Sounds like a JB to me!

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    Quote Originally Posted by oilpit View Post
    Jumping back to the JB thing, I really don't see why people are so vehemently opposed to the idea of EVH having used one. I have hear JBs quite a bit and I would not be surprised in the slightest if he had used them, especially his older sounds...lots of high end and midrange and somewhat spongy bass. Sounds like a JB to me!
    JB's have insane upper mids, and I really don't hear that in EVH's sound, yes there's what comes from the Marshall with Celestions, but not the poke of an A5 JB. Instead he has much broader midrange, and the bass & especially lower mids are chewy, rather than just spongy. Which is exactly how the hybrid Custom/59 gets described. Or the '78, though that gets some of that character from the A2 magnet.

    If you are arguing for an A2 JB, I have no personal experience with those, but have heard those smooth out the upper mid spike, and the bass character. I don't really remember Holdsworth's earlier sounds. But A5? Really don't think so.

    And the scan of the EVH Axology that evhguitars pasted talks about how he uses pickups that he hacked up himself. JB is already well potted, so why would he be repotting them?

    There's a lot of secondary evidence that points away from him using anything that simple, and especially that overwound in any of his main guitars. Now a hybrid? Who knows, especially if the other coil was not a '59 as many have supposed...

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    It mainly depends what time period or recorded track of the EVH sound.
    EVH changed necks and pickups constantly he also told little white lies.
    His tone changed constantly.
    EVH in the early days had Seymour rewind his Gibson PAFs.
    The JBs were rewound Gibsons PAFs.
    That scanned article is from mid 80s.
    If one were truely able to know what pickup was used or not used.

    The question would not have to be asked.
    The possibility of the pups Seymour rewound for EVH in the early days quite possibly could be JB windiings and nothing can rule out that EVH may have used a JB at one time or another.

    EVH's favorite pickup had dead readings in the early 80s when Tom Anderson put a neck on Franky and reset the Floyd Rose in the correct position..Tom had thought he had broken the famous pup.
    30 years later the same thing happened to Chip Ellis when he was examining Franky...he thought he had broken the pickup.

    I agree with a couple of previous posts the question is a bit absurd and the magic dead reading EVH pup could even be JB winding.
    Can it be documented..no..so what is the point?
    Last edited by evhguitars; 03-01-2010 at 10:48 PM.

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    Quote Originally Posted by evhguitars View Post
    EVH's favorite pickup had dead readings in the early 80s when Tom Anderson put a neck on Franky and reset the Floyd Rose in the correct position..Tom had thought he had broken the famous pup.
    30 years later the same thing happened to Chip Ellis when he was examining Franky...he thought he had broken the pickup.
    The dead reading could have been confusion over abnormal readings. This is supported by DiMarzio's Dual Resonance patents that originated with studying Franky's pickup. Though they turned around and created very high output pickups for him, where did they come up with the idea of using different gauges of wire on each coil?

    For duplicating most of his early studio whammy leads, the 59/custom hybrids are widely held to come closest, which further supports that it was a partial short or wild coil mismatch. It's pretty easy to believe Ed could have mixed up coils from two different pickups by accident, given the crazy guitar butchery he was prone to back then. (Oh, that poor Destroyer...)

    It is well known that he used different guitars for different parts in the studio. But it's pretty well documented that he used an original PAF transplanted from a Les Paul, the Super 70, possibly DiMarzio PAF replicas, '59, and a "Custom Duncan" (often argued to be a Custom Custom, with some pretty persuasive demos). The JB is far hotter than anything else he's known to have used. I'm puzzled by the insistance he used it, when there's so many more likely candidates given his recorded tone & tastes across the 70s and 80s. Open, low gain pickups into a wide open amp seem much more his thing. Lots of dynamics, compression from the power section, not the pickup thrashing the amp input.

    It's certainly possible he used it for some parts, but it doesn't seem to be a secret part of his core tone.
    Last edited by Despair; 03-01-2010 at 11:14 PM.

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses


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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    Yep, note the 13-14K resistance. That's very likely 43AWG, where the JB is over 16K of 44AWG. If it's 44AWG, that's underwound a good bit.

    The new Frankie replica appears to be an underwound, degaussed Custom Custom, unless it's got mismatched coils.

    It's frustrating few bother to measure the resistance of individual coils and publicly release the results. Especially since the Dual Resonance patents are expired as far as I know.

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    The point is... this is just 1 pup that EVH used out of very many throughout the years!

    Another Frustration is the Values of the tone pots and bleed kits used are rarely discussed..or disclosed and pretty much not taken into account when it comes to EVH's secrets..because the majority think it was a pup and a pot with nothing else added..

    The major point is...the vintage tone and sound of EVH was in his own body and mind filled with drugs and alcohol and those vintage tones and sounds are now dead and gone... forever...except for what was left on the recordings.
    Last edited by evhguitars; 03-02-2010 at 12:55 AM.

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    Default Re: '70s-'80s and JB -- any guesses

    Yo, i'm Ryan™.

    https://www.facebook.com/patchworklv
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=der6aGGzQTk
    ^link to 7 tracks of my band, Patchwork

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