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Thread: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

  1. #1
    Varg
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    Default Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    I have an HSH guitar I'd like to rewire with autosplits for both humbuckers. The guitar has a 5 way switch, one volume, one tone.

    1) Does anyone have a wiring diagram they can point me towards for this?

    2) Also, I don't use the tone control on the bridge pickup, so how would I bypass that, so the tone control only affects the middle single coil and neck humbucker?

    3) And finally, I prefer 500K pots, but think the 250K pot would be better for the single coil. So, do you think if I use a 500K for the volume, and a 250K for the tone it would balance out nicely?

    4) I would normally use a 0.022 cap, but am thinking maybe a 0.047 one would be better for this to take even more highs from the single coil (which will be going through a 500K pot)? Will that make much difference? I have a 0.022 cap here so if it doesn't matter much it would save me buying a 0.047.
    Last edited by Varg; 12-27-2010 at 05:08 AM.

  2. #2
    RiffRaffologist ArtieToo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Use this diagram. Even though it shows a Strat, those are humbuckers in the neck and bridge. Yours will wire the same. Unfortunately, you can't eliminate the tone from the bridge if you go for the auto-split. That 5-way has its limitations.

    You could however, if you opt for a Superswitch.

    Edit: P.S. If went with the Superswitch, you could also switch caps when you selected the middle pup.

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    Ultimate Tone Member MikeM's Avatar
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    If you're patient, I'm working on a diagram that willl do all regular strat tones, I.e bridge parallel, bridge split n mid split, mid parralel etc and then the HB tones, bridge series, both, neck series. Not sure what I can do for the last two positions but I'll figure something out. Right now I just need to figure out the phasing and keeping everything hum cancelling.

  4. #4
    Varg
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Excellent, thank you Artietoo! Just what I was needing.

    Mike, I would never use all those other options - the autosplit will be enough for me, I just really like the notch tones when done with single coils.

  5. #5
    Varg
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    I just tried to wire the bridge humbucker like the way it is in the diagram ArtieToo posted. Nothing happened, which seemed odd.
    It's a Bill Lawrence USA 500XL.
    So I had a look on the BL USA website and found this diagram.




    The only bit I looked at was where it said to connect the white and green to the unused lug of the tone pot. I did it and it seems to work - never come across that before. However, it means it doesn't work as an autosplit - I ONLY wanted it to split in the notch position.

    Anyone have any idea what this is all about?

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    Slam Dunk da Funk Funkfingers's Avatar
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    What that Bill Lawrence diagram is about is the same thing that Seymour Duncan calls Spin-A-Split. (See Tech Tips on the main SD website.)

    Rather than be totally diverted to ground, the second coil of the 'bucker is partially diverted according to the position of the pot. (Peavey used the same idea on their T-60 guitar.) This way, you can achieve a partial increase in brightness without a total loss of hum-cancellation.

  7. #7
    Varg
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Thanks for the info man!

    Does it mean I can't set it like the diagram Artie posted, for autosplit then? Is the BL USA pickup designed so it can't be done?

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    RiffRaffologist ArtieToo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    No, you can do it, but just be aware that BL color codes may not match SD color codes. (Let me find that chart somewhere.)

    Here it is: humbucker_wiring_color_codes

    Edit: Note that still may not help with phasing. There's no standard for color codes or mag polarity. Here's a webpage I made that shows a simple technique to match your pup to Duncan wiring and polarity. It does mean the pup has to be disconnected.

    Pickup wires ID

    (fixed)
    Last edited by ArtieToo; 12-27-2010 at 09:21 AM.

  9. #9
    Varg
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Thanks Artie - the diagram there would suggest that the green and white wires should be the ones that go to the five way switch for the auto-split then, right? That's what I was trying originally, and nothing was happening.

    Never mind, the current switch is one of the import style things, I've just now ordered CTS pots, orange drop and a good quality five way switch, so I'll try again when I get the parts.

    I've learned something from this thread anyway, thank you folks.

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    Slam Dunk da Funk Funkfingers's Avatar
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Varg, for your stated requirements in the original posting, the auto-spilt via one pole of the five-way pickup selector switch is the smartest choice.

    The Peavey T60/Bill Lawrence approach really requires a Tone pot per HB to be split.

  11. #11
    Varg
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Funkfingers View Post
    Varg, for your stated requirements in the original posting, the auto-spilt via one pole of the five-way pickup selector switch is the smartest choice.

    The Peavey T60/Bill Lawrence approach really requires a Tone pot per HB to be split.
    Well, the neck humbucker is (I think) some old Fender thing (I don't use the neck pickup much on this guitar or I'd fit the DiMarzio PAF I have in my spares box!) so hopefully THAT one will work with the five way switch auto-split method.

    You are right though, auto-split method is tidier if I can get it to work with both humbuckers. If not, it's no big deal, I can't see me ever needing to switch from a screaming metal tone to a "Sultans of Swing" tone in the same song.

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    Slam Dunk da Funk Funkfingers's Avatar
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Varg View Post
    I can't see me ever needing to switch from a screaming metal tone to a "Sultans of Swing" tone in the same song.
    Well, if that need should ever arise, there is something that you can do. Somewhere, on the front of your guitar, not very far from the bridge pickup and the bridge/tailpiece assembly is THE VOLUME CONTROL.

  13. #13
    Varg
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Funkfingers View Post
    Well, if that need should ever arise, there is something that you can do. Somewhere, on the front of your guitar, not very far from the bridge pickup and the bridge/tailpiece assembly is THE VOLUME CONTROL.
    Ha ha, thanks for the tip, I actually use the volume control a lot already.

    What I mean is if I was playing something with a lot of gain, on the bridge pickup, with volume high, I wouldn't then want to a)switch to the notch position b)turn tone knob to split coils c) turn volume down to right level.
    The auto-split does awy with b at least.

  14. #14
    Ultimate Tone Slacker
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeM View Post
    If you're patient, I'm working on a diagram that willl do all regular strat tones, I.e bridge parallel, bridge split n mid split, mid parralel etc and then the HB tones, bridge series, both, neck series. Not sure what I can do for the last two positions but I'll figure something out. Right now I just need to figure out the phasing and keeping everything hum cancelling.
    Bridge split + neck split (both to outer coils) and bridge split + neck split (both to inner coils) are popular options. If you only do one of those, I'd do outer coils, as it's a more teleish tone, which is more distinct from your existing list than the vaguely strattish, sorta notchy tone the inner coils give.

    And of course bridge series + neck series, out of phase -- but that one is often regarded as not terribly useful if you don't have a 2 volume & 2 tone control configuration.

  15. #15
    Varg
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Okay I got the new pots, cap and switch and fitted them last night. I followed the diagram Artie posted but could only get sound from the middle pickup.

    I thought I may have made some elementary error, so wired it as per the "normal" HSH wiring diagram and, it worked perfectly.

    Would anyone know what I may have done wrong? The bridge pickup is the BL USA one, and the neck is a 3 conductor model. They should still split properly shouldn't they?
    I thought about just wiring one of the humbuckers to autosplit, but the whole wiring of the switch changes and I wouldn't know how to modify it.

    BTW, when I wired it first time, I had the switch "back to front" - would that matter? I changed it to match exactly the diagram when I returned to normal HSH wiring. I assumed it didn't really make a difference but thought I better mention it just in case.
    Last edited by Varg; 01-02-2011 at 12:55 AM.

  16. #16
    Ultimate Tone Member MikeM's Avatar
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Despair View Post
    Bridge split + neck split (both to outer coils) and bridge split + neck split (both to inner coils) are popular options. If you only do one of those, I'd do outer coils, as it's a more teleish tone, which is more distinct from your existing list than the vaguely strattish, sorta notchy tone the inner coils give.

    And of course bridge series + neck series, out of phase -- but that one is often regarded as not terribly useful if you don't have a 2 volume & 2 tone control configuration.
    Sadly it's not so much what I WANT to do, but more what I can manage to fit in there with the 8 other positions.. I have pretty much got it now though, although I have, one coil from the neck and bridge in series, in parallel with the other two in series. Close enough for me, I think this is as close as I will get to an everything axe.

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    A Ficus ehdwuld's Avatar
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Quote Originally Posted by Varg View Post
    Okay I got the new pots, cap and switch and fitted them last night. I followed the diagram Artie posted but could only get sound from the middle pickup.

    I thought I may have made some elementary error, so wired it as per the "normal" HSH wiring diagram and, it worked perfectly.

    Would anyone know what I may have done wrong? The bridge pickup is the BL USA one, and the neck is a 3 conductor model. They should still split properly shouldn't they?
    I thought about just wiring one of the humbuckers to autosplit, but the whole wiring of the switch changes and I wouldn't know how to modify it.

    BTW, when I wired it first time, I had the switch "back to front" - would that matter? I changed it to match exactly the diagram when I returned to normal HSH wiring. I assumed it didn't really make a difference but thought I better mention it just in case.

    ok so
    you got it wired

    and the humbuckers dont work?

    only the single in he middle?
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  18. #18
    Varg
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Quote Originally Posted by ehdwuld View Post
    ok so
    you got it wired

    and the humbuckers dont work?

    only the single in he middle?
    Yeah, that seemed to be the case. I could get sound from the middle position and the 2 and 4, so I guessed it was the single coil I could hear.

  19. #19
    A Ficus ehdwuld's Avatar
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    I thought I may have made some elementary error, so wired it as per the "normal" HSH wiring diagram and, it worked perfectly.
    so which diagram is the 'normal' one ?

    arties?

    or did you just remove the auto splits

    if you just removed the auto split
    then I would suspect you had that part mis-wired somehow
    EHD
    . .... -.. .-- ..- .-.. -.. --- .-.. --- --. .. ... -
    Just here surfing Guitar Pron
    RG2EX1 w/ SD hot-rodded pickups / RG4EXFM1 w/ Carvin S22j/b + FVN middle
    Candy Apple Red Squire HSS / SR500 / Martin 000CE-1
    Carvin Belair / Laney GC80A Acoustic Amp (a gift from Guitar Player Mag)
    Carvin Redline 600 2x10
    GNX3000 (yea I'm a modeler)

  20. #20
    Varg
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    Default Re: Auto-split for HSH guitar?

    Quote Originally Posted by ehdwuld View Post
    so which diagram is the 'normal' one ?

    arties?

    or did you just remove the auto splits

    if you just removed the auto split
    then I would suspect you had that part mis-wired somehow
    No the "normal" one's here:

    http://www.seymourduncan.com/support...c=HSH_1v_1t_5w

    You can see the switch wiring is quite different here, to the one in Artie's autosplit one.

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