Is it true?

[UberMetalDood]

I heard that Charvel ProMods will no longer be made in Japan :o Apparently they're moving production to Indonesia or something. Will they still offer the USA Prod. models?

[TattooedCarrot]

Last I read on the Jackson forums was that they were in limbo. They no longer make the USA model (except custom shop), that's why they were renamed ProMod and production moved to Japan. Most who have experience with both say the differences are negligible and both are equal in quality and build. Although I'm in the market for one, I won't buy one made in Indonesia or China. And if they do move production there, the price better come down.

[verbotenco]

Last I read on the Jackson forums was that they were in limbo. They no longer make the USA model (except custom shop), that's why they were renamed ProMod and production moved to Japan. Most who have experience with both say the differences are negligible and both are equal in quality and build. Although I'm in the market for one, I won't buy one made in Indonesia or China. And if they do move production there, the price better come down.

You have never seen Indonesian made guitar obviously. The craftsmanship certainly is on par with that of the Japanese models. Why the price drops is because of the labor cost that is way cheaper. You should break out of the myopic mentality. Not all third world countries are $hitty places that only churn out piece of $hit products. Did you know that Yamaha manufactured acoustic pianos here? Cort also has a manufacturing site somewhere in Java, as does Ibanez RG models.

But if image and bragging rights are priority for you, maybe USA model is the proper fit.

[verbotenco]

And the reason why guitar manufacturers move their production to Indonesia or any other third world country is so you American people can lay your hands on some of the most prestigious US brands and feed your kids with quality guitars without breaking the bank or your retirement savings. Can you imagine how dysfunctional your situation would become if everywhere you go all you'd find were US-made Fenders and Gibsons? Or Japan-made Ibanez?

[JohnnyGuitar]

Can you imagine how dysfunctional your situation would become if everywhere you go all you'd find were US-made Fenders and Gibsons? Or Japan-made Ibanez?

Guitars are just a symptom. Actually, if the USA would have kept more manufacturing in its borders its citizens would have been better off in many aspects. More jobs, a much smaller deficit...

The real dysfunctional thing is the fact that so many western countries are just buyers nowadays, without being sellers.

[UberMetalDood]

You have never seen Indonesian made guitar obviously. The craftsmanship certainly is on par with that of the Japanese models. Why the price drops is because of the labor cost that is way cheaper. You should break out of the myopic mentality. Not all third world countries are $hitty places that only churn out piece of $hit products. Did you know that Yamaha manufactured acoustic pianos here? Cort also has a manufacturing site somewhere in Java, as does Ibanez RG models.

But if image and bragging rights are priority for you, maybe USA model is the proper fit.

Hold on just a minute there. That's some crazy $h!t you're talking. First of all, labor is cheaper in Indonesia because Japanese are far, far, far more skilled workers than Indonesian workers. You obviously don't know a thing about Japanese products. I have seen plenty of Indonesian guitars and trust me, they are cheaper because of inferior materials and inferior workmanship.

You shouldn't let your pride get in the way of common sense. A lot of companies manufacture there. They also manufacture in China and Mexico and Korea, but more often than not is because their best products are made in their home countries.

Indonesia's best offering could possibly be the Ibanez Premium line; however, I have played those models and they are not on the same level of the Prestige. There are subtle, but significant enough differences. It's definitely a huge leap forward for Indonesian manufacturing, but don't get ahead of yourself and start acting like you're competing on level with USA and Japan (arguably the worlds two best manufacturers).

[FuseG4]

Hold on just a minute there. That's some crazy $h!t you're talking. First of all, labor is cheaper in Indonesia because Japanese are far, far, far more skilled workers than Indonesian workers. You obviously don't know a thing about Japanese products. I have seen plenty of Indonesian guitars and trust me, they are cheaper because of inferior materials and inferior workmanship.

You shouldn't let your pride get in the way of common sense. A lot of companies manufacture there. They also manufacture in China and Mexico and Korea, but more often than not is because their best products are made in their home countries.

Indonesia's best offering could possibly be the Ibanez Premium line; however, I have played those models and they are not on the same level of the Prestige. There are subtle, but significant enough differences. It's definitely a huge leap forward for Indonesian manufacturing, but don't get ahead of yourself and start acting like you're competing on level with USA and Japan (arguably the worlds two best manufacturers).

Big "+1"

Indonesia makes some OK stuff but I've played enough Cort and Samick stuff to know that they are passable but they're not CIJ Fenders, they're not ESP, they're not Ibanez.

[verbotenco]

Hold on just a minute there. That's some crazy $h!t you're talking. First of all, labor is cheaper in Indonesia because Japanese are far, far, far more skilled workers than Indonesian workers. You obviously don't know a thing about Japanese products. I have seen plenty of Indonesian guitars and trust me, they are cheaper because of inferior materials and inferior workmanship.

Ha..ha... you are way behind. Absolutely not. Labor is cheaper here because the standard of living is way below Japan, nothing to do with skills. In the 80s the Japanese and the West are way superior in terms of skills but that was 30 years ago. Your statement is fatally flaw and without ground.

The cost to pay a Japanese worker to do a certain office job will require higher pay than the cost to pay an Indonesian worker to do the same job in Indonesia. How could you not know this?

Here the top pay for a skilled carpenter is about 9 US dollars for a full day, including meal and everything. With pay rate so low, who could resist?

Why else would Japanese and US manufacturers move production to Asia if not for cheap labor? If the craftsmanship is so poor none of them would come here cause that strategy would spell disaster: Poor craftsmanship, poor quality products, tarnished brand. And no body would buy the product.

I don't know $hit about Japanese brands? See, that's another fatal flaw of you American people. You really think we only consume Chinese crap cause we can't afford Japanese brands? Since the 80s Yamaha, Honda, Toyota, Toshiba, even Sony has been around here to churn out stuff you believe Made in Japan. It's 2012 for fuk sake, the Western world is down in the ground.

You are an ignorant, nearsighted idiot, seriously.

[verbotenco]

You shouldn't let your pride get in the way of common sense.

You are the one who lacks common sense dude. So, it's okay for Jackson guitars to move Charvel Pro Mod production to Indonesia even though the craftsmanship is (as you claim) poor? What the fuk?!!!! That's what you call common sense?

[verbotenco]

A lot of companies manufacture there. They also manufacture in China and Mexico and Korea, but more often than not is because their best products are made in their home countries.

Their best products are made in their home countries cause they are priced very expensive. And no body would pay a fortune for a product made in the Third World, regardless of the quality. The stamp "Made in USA', Made in Japan, Made in Germany are still important to convey the sense of quality, regardless of the actual fact. The manufacturers know this, even though they hate it cause their margins are now squeezed.

There are also exceptions. Like Nike, I suppose none of the Air Jordans are made in USA, though it costs 100 dollars. What about BMWs? Are BMWs made in Asia crap? They must be, as you insinuated.

[astrozombie]

my jaguar is from the same japanese company (i assume)

my jaguar is higher quality than some american fenders ive played.

[marvelous_seven]

I don't know for sure if what verbotenco said is the truth or not, but I can attest that custom-made guitars made here in Indonesia are comparable with US-made production guitars with just a fraction of it's price.

[Jocelyn]

Hey verbotenco, chill man. Dont take it so personally. you are really taking what Tattooed Carrot said all out of context.

[Left_Hand_Strat]

Shut up with the price war man....

[crguti]

I buy only Scandinavian made... f*ck off the rest of the world

[TattooedCarrot]

You have never seen Indonesian made guitar obviously.

I have, I don't share your opinion. The obvious thing here is you don't know me, or what guitars I have or have no experience with. Nor does it matter.

But if image and bragging rights are priority for you, maybe USA model is the proper fit.

Your sarcasm is unprovoked. Don't be a dick.

[verbotenco]

Hey verbotenco, chill man. Dont take it so personally. you are really taking what Tattooed Carrot said all out of context.

Nothing personal. Just straightening out the facts.

[tc]

You guys sure about Indonesia? Because FMIC doesn't really make a lot of stuff there...it'd make a lot more sense to go with a factory they already use a lot.

Jackson has the US, Japan and India.
Fender has the US, Mexico, Japan, Korea and China.
Squier has China, India and Indonesia.
Gretsch, etc...no idea.

So if you think about it, while FMIC owns it, the brand is usually called "Jackson/Charvel". There's a historic relationship there. I think India or China are far more likely to get the job. Korea and Indonesia aren't used that much by FMIC compared to brands like Ibanez.

Just speculation though.

[TattooedCarrot]

Nothing personal. Just straightening out the facts.

No, you're not. You're emotionally defensive and personal because you're from Indonesia. Please, climb down from the high horse.

[atreidesheir]

I have experience with G&L guitars.

I am willing to say Indonesian G&L Tributes are inferior (to the previous ones) because of the materials they are made from. They stopped buying quality wood stocks to ship to their factories. They move the production to Indonesia AND diluted their parts sourcing resources. It is a chain of events.

2003 models were nice guitars. Decent wood, nice hardware.
The 2010 models made from crap, play like crap.

Indonesia should have a much better 21st century. Education and demographics are in their favor for the next 30 years or so.