Seymour Duncan California '50s Set Doubt

[ItsaBass]

To make a long story short, volume is the key. Crank your amp.

To make a short story long...

Old-style Strat pickups need to be played loud and hard in order to break up like you are probably used to from those MIM pickups. And a lot of that has not only to do with output, but tonality. The pickups don't inherently have a very strong midrange, so they seem "smaller" than high output pickups to your amp. But when they do break up just right, there is nothing like them. Their inherent cleanliness is actually their biggest strength once you start overdriving the amp. People think of Hendrix as an example of how Strats sound when overdriving an amp, but remember what volumes he played at to get Strats sounding that way. Also, listen to the albums, and you'll see right away that he used clean Strat tones quite a lot, so there is plenty of room for clean Strat tones even in heavy music.

As for pickup height, I'd start at the recommended factory settings and work from there. For old-style Strat pickups, that's 2.4mm low side and 2mm high side. Drill bits work well for making these measurements. (I use mini screwdrivers with marked diameters.) The bridge will sound thin, but that's the point IMO. Pump that baby through a cranked amp and you'll see the benefit of having it be that thin. Razor blade distortion like nothing else.

Also, try the 2nd switch position (B+M) with the farthest tone control rolled all the way down. Or, if your Strat has modern wiring, you can just use the 1st position (B) with that tone rolled all the way down. Instant hair on the tone by doing that. You can also rig the guitar with a lever or push/pull switch that will put the bridge and middle pickups in series for a 12-13K pickup. That swallows up a lot of that super present high end and gives you a healthy amount of high output midrangeyness to drive the amp.

[Jocelyn]

The length of the pickup wires have nothing to do with the tone.. They are vintage output pickups. So hmm lower output which adds to the sweetness and brightness. Crank up your amp. Your stock pickups would defiantly drive your amp more for these you need to crank up the amp.
CHeers

[freefrog]

Thanks for your answers!. Uhm, Do you think the wires' length of the pickup affects its sustain or gain? Or as I've read on this post before: it doesn't matter?.

The PU wires will add a tiny bit of capacitance to your wiring (and capacitance tends to weaken the high range)... But it won't be noticeable in this case.

I used a set of SSL1's when I was young and I've still a set of those in one of my guitars, 32 years later: on the basis of this not so short experience, I'd say that a good sustain can be achieved with such PU's. As mentioned above, check the height of your pickups but also the action of your guitar (sustain begins there).

Also... think to try all the "spices" that famous Strat players tend to use: strong strings, thick pick, Tube Screamer or booster, cranked up (pre)amp and... a long cable or a curly cable whose capacitance will give more beef to your mids - because yes, your GUITAR cable will change the tone of your passive PU's, especially if they are single coils... that's what SRV and Hendrix known and used for their advantage, and it's traditionally a misunderstood or ignored parameter.

[AudioWonderland]

Thank you Gypsyblue for your answer. Well, I think the Luthier didn't cut (or shorten) the wires cause his assistant told me: "The wires are usually rolled and put together". However, I've seen in some Youtube videos that it's recommended to shorten the wires at a minimum size when installing the pickups. The wires of the SSL-1s are not unshield, I mean they have a covering material all along the wires and a bare tip at the end.

According to SD's page, those pickups are calibrated, but i don't think the bridge one has more wound than the others. I guess there is a special pickup (SSL-5) which has been made overwounded specially for the bridge position (getting more output than usual but less highs).

I don't know if the wire lenght can affect the output level or not (considering that all the wire is shielded).

Not cutting the leads to length will have no impact on the sound. I have done that many times. I like to swap pickups a lot. There is no way to know how long they will need to be in the next guitar so I leave them alone.

Squires are not known for their impeccable setups. The pickups are likely closer than they probably boosting output. They also use a fairly hot magnet which will boost its output as well.

Its entirely possibly your tech set the new pickups heights to minimize the impact of the magnets pull on the string which is what he should have done. It sounds to me on the surface at least that you are seeing/hearing about what I would have expected from the change you described

[Gypsyblue]

Not cutting the leads to length will have no impact on the sound. I have done that many times. I like to swap pickups a lot. There is no way to know how long they will need to be in the next guitar so I leave them alone.

Squires are not known for their impeccable setups. The pickups are likely closer than they probably boosting output. They also use a fairly hot magnet which will boost its output as well.

Its entirely possibly your tech set the new pickups heights to minimize the impact of the magnets pull on the string which is what he should have done. It sounds to me on the surface at least that you are seeing/hearing about what I would have expected from the change you described

I always cut unshielded wires to length. The shorter the better in terms of noise reduction, and Strats are hummy enough already. Just my way of doing things.

[tonello]

Hi everyone,

I'm new in this Forum, but I've been reading some of the posts so I think here I'll be able to find people for helping or guiding me with my new set of pickups. Thank you in advance for your responses.

I bought the California 50s Set (3 SSL-1 pickups) and I put them on a Fender Standard Stratocaster MIM 2011. It gave me a new brighter sound, with more highs and perfect for playing funk, rock, pop, and those genres that need a clear, bright and brillant sound. I really like that vintage (bell) tone on my Strat, but the problem is that I hear less output from my pickups, I compared the output with a Squiet Strat Bullet and that Squier's signal was louder (and with more sustain) than the Fender (with new pups) one. I used the two guitars with the same conditions (a series of pedals containing an MXR Smart Gate M-135) going to a Fender FM212R amplifier.

My question is. Is it normal to lose sustain (and output level) with the SD SSL-1 pickups?, (The Luthier who installed the pickups didn't shorten the SSL-1's wires, he just rolled them), Can this affect my current sustain I have?, Should it have been better to cut the wires while installing them?, or maybe Should I try a new noise gate or noise supressor pedal such as the Boss NS-2? (Or some pedal without a big "cutting" effect like the MXR Smart Gate?.

Thanks, I hope I can get some help from you.

I think this might be an issue of output of the pickups. You don't seem to be having a problem with noise or hum, which is typical of wires that aren't cut short enough. I think the issue is that because the pups are based on the original Fender Strat, then the output is much less than that of the new Strats. Over time, as music increased in output levels, people got higher output pickups, where to get a stock Fender with the same kind of bell sound as the original Strat, you have to look at the Classic series. My recommendation would be to get something like the MXR 133 Micro Amp, which should boost your signal a little more. If that doesn't work then my second recommendation would be to get either a Custom Staggered SSL-5 set or a Custom Flat SSL-6 set.

[AudioWonderland]

I always cut unshielded wires to length. The shorter the better in terms of noise reduction, and Strats are hummy enough already. Just my way of doing things.

Sure, but its minimal and if shielded properly its of no consequence

[lazyfinger]

I run SSL-2 in the neck and SSL-6 in the bridge on a Fender Strat. Output and sustain is not a problem from either, however SSL-6 is hotter, and I have both set up around the same height, mainly because I prefer the extra kick for overdrive when I switch to bridge position.

[newjarek]

Hi,

Thank you all for your responses, now I have clear some doubts I had before. For example: That the wires' length won't affect the sustain or gain of my pups (it could affect the hum or noise but at minimal), and the other thing it's clear for me is that these vintage pups are made with less output level than current MIM pups or ceramic pups, so I need to calibrate very carefully the pups' heigth and process a little bit better my signal before going through an amp.

Well, as a member of this forum said, maybe I'm so accustomed to ceramic pups and high level output sounds, cause I've been playing my Squier Strat (with ceramic stock pups) for almost 9 years and now I can feel a diference with my Strat MIM with vintage alnico pups.

However, in general, I really love the California Set tone, it's clearer, brighter and more defined than regular pups, you can get a very high tone without producing an annoying super treble sound. It's just a perfect balance between highs and mids that create a bell-tone sound. IMO I prefer the Neck and Middle pups in this set.

Here, there's a video (an audio demo) I recorded with my Fender Strat MIM and its new set of pups, I'm using here the neck position. The signal is processed through a Crybaby Classic, MXR Noise Gate and a Boss DD-6.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_sSOxSpYPs

Again, thank you all for your help. I'll continue practicing and enjoying the SD California 50s to obtain better sounds from my Strat.

[GilmourD]

So the wires' lenght doesn't affect the tone (or gain) of the pickup?.

If we're talking about 30 foot run, yeah. The length that comes with the pickup? I don't think even Eddie Van Halen or Eric Johnson can hear the difference.

[uOpt]

All right, a couple things:

1) you either want vintage style strat pickups with "bell capabilities" or not

2) if you do you'll have to look into compressors, treble boosters and the like

3) the lack of sustain isn't actual sustain, if you were to record acoustically you'd see that what the strings do isn't much different than any. But vintage style Strat pickups are very bright and the higher frequencies decay much quicker than the lower frequencies so electronically it sounds "shorter"

4) to improve #3, looking see #2

[newjarek]

Now, I'm using a MD-2 (the gain boost circuit) as a booster. And also I turn off my MXR Smart Gate when I need to do a solo that requires long sustained note and a little bit of feedback.

These SSL-1s are such a great pickups!!!...

http://soundcloud.com/newjarek/demo-sonido-seymour-duncan

[Gypsyblue]

Sure, but its minimal and if shielded properly its of no consequence

Well that's the point: Strats and Tele's are NOT shielded properly. Never have been. Gibson always used shielded cable even with P90 single coils. I'll admit though that I removed the black and white cloth covered unshielded wires from the three Fender pickups on a Strat one time and installed Gibson style shielded cable on those pickups. They still picked up that awful 60 cycle hum and buzzed.

[joegore]

I'm going to go to bat for the humble SSL-1. IMHO, this pickup doesn't get nearly the attention it deserves. I kid you not, it sounds at least as good as the original pickups in my '63 Strat. (Yes, really.) It's not for everyone — all the usual issues pertaining to classic Strat pickups apply, and they just aren't going to slam the amp like anything overwound, or with ceramic magnets. But they are very, very, VERY authentic-sounding, and a great choice if you dig the tones of the great ’60s Strat players.

Also: MIM Strat + SSL-1s = high-end vintage-style guitar at a low-ball price. I'm just sayin'.

[AudioWonderland]

Well that's the point: Strats and Tele's are NOT shielded properly. Never have been. Gibson always used shielded cable even with P90 single coils. I'll admit though that I removed the black and white cloth covered unshielded wires from the three Fender pickups on a Strat one time and installed Gibson style shielded cable on those pickups. They still picked up that awful 60 cycle hum and buzzed.

Thats why you shield the entire cavity. It works. Actually Fender is doing a lot better these days. The classic vibe tele I bought last year was actually shielded very well

[freefrog]

I kid you not, it sounds at least as good as the original pickups in my '63 Strat. (Yes, really).

Having worked the last summer on a 62 Strat with original PU's, I have to agree.

[kilphody]

I have a set that I run into an ISP Decimator G using a 30' Vox coil cord in a 57 Tweed Deluxe (5E3) Pure Strat Bliss... Also- In my 40 some-odd yrs making and modding gits I never cut pup leads unless absolutely necessary and I never buy a used pup w/ cut leads(just my hang up).

[Cathy Carter Duncan]

What a great group of toneologists we have here. And thanks for chiming in. IN the old days, I would have leaned over from my typerwriter, correcting selectric mind you, and asked so, Seymour..... what's the answer. Letter after letter. So thanks everyone, Nice to have so many other tone lovers out there..

And yup.... sure there is some teeny tiny bit in the extra wire, but its adjustments and the magnets. Just as you all have pointed out. And I agree with Joe.... SSL-1 are just beautiful!. but... they can have some noise, and outputs just not the same as ceramics. Guess thats why we make an endless variety. I could never say no.

[newjarek]

Yes, I really like the classic SSL-1 sound. It's so bright and clear. But maybe I could consider getting a SSL-5 for the bridge position, because I'd like to have a little more gain and sustain for distortion, but conserving the vintage and balanced tone while playing in clean.

Another thing I've noticed in my Strat, is that the bridge itself is a little bit up, I mean it's not touching the guitar's body, but it is like 2mm above the surface (So it gives me the opportunity to rise up the tone when using the tremolo bar). In my Squier strat the bridge is tounching directly the wood (I can only bring down the tone when using the bar). Do you thing that this bridge heigth can affect the sustain in general?.

[Stratman]

I have a matched set of SSL-1 (California 50’s Set)

Neck and Bridge measure exactly the same ohms
Middle is RPRW and measure only 2 ohms less than the neck and bridge.

Yes, their output is less than any ceramic pickup, I would rather have that clear bell tone than CeraMUK (e.g., ceramic mud!)