Pickup comparison Burstbuckers & Sethlovers

[Swansong78]

Anyone tried both burstbuckers 1 & 2 with a les paul in comparison with a set of seth lovers? Just wondering because i'd like to know what the seth lovers offer differently tonality wise from the burstbuckers in a les paul. Also if you happen to own a flexi 50 with an avatar 2x12 with 1 red fang and 1 g12h30 advice would be greatly appreciated. Supposedly the seth lovers are supposed to have less bottom end, more midrange honk?, and smoother highs.


Tony

[Simon_F]

Welcome!

I've never played Burstbuckers, but I do have a set of Seth Lovers in a '96 Les Paul Standard. They are excellent pickups for classic rock, blues and jazz. Plenty of midrange honk, a soft bottom end and smooth highs pretty much describes them. I like them a lot!

Here's a review that compares several Gibson and Duncan humbuckers, including the BBs and Seths:

http://www.legendarytones.com/humbpus1.htm

[grams]

Hi,

the german guitar Magazin "Gitarre & Bass" compared 19 PAF-style pup's, the Seth Lover and the burstbuckers were among them. They even recorded some sound clips which you can download online:
http://www1.gitarrebass.de/magazine/0502/paf.htm
I personally don't like those soundclips - they're not played objective and additionally I don't think he plays them good. But anyway - he put them in a 2003 Gibson LP Historic Collection Reissue "Tom Murphy" which is directly connected into a 1974 Marshallcombo; mics used are: AKD D-21, 47 Neumann CM 7.

Here are the (more or less good translated ) opinions:
I should note, that all pup's were compared to an "original '62" PAF...
Seth Lover:
- very glassy
- one of the most brilliant sounding pup's in the competition
- nice compression
- not too much bass
- not too fat output
- "open", "breathing" sound
- "Larry Carlton" & "Robben Ford" are associated with this pup

Burstbuckers:
- much closer to original PAF than the Classic '57
- open, glassy
- tele-style base sound (twang)
- reacting "not as complex"/softer as the PAF
- quite strong output = hot
- might sound too harsh with a bright guitar
- "Gary Moore" is associated with this pup

There are also the Antiquity, the '59, the PG from DUncan in the test (for full list see the website).

My personal favorite is the Harry Häusel Vintage.

greetz
grams

PS: If you need other pup tests from that mag, let me know...

[Lewguitar]

I don't know where this glassy thing is coming from because I don't hear the Seth or the Burstbucker as glassy. Not even slightly. 100% disagreement there, though I have never tried the alnico 5 Burstbucker...only the original alnico 2 version.

The a2 Burstbucker's in my buddy's Les Paul Historic Plaintop have really pronounced and plucky mids that did take me back to the years when I used to own a couple of real '58 and '59 Les Pauls. I found the Burstbuckers to be very warm. chewy and plucky...and to have the same sort of slightly muddy tone from the neck pickup when I roll down the volume to go from a soloing tone to a clearer tone that my old Les Pauls had. (the reason I switched from Les Pauls and 335's to Strats and Teles over 30 years ago!)

My Hamer Monoco has a Seth Lover neck and Custom Custom bridge and when we compared the Seth neck to the Burstbucker neck I felt that the Seth had the more usable tone. I liked the Burstbucker alot...but the Seth could do everything the Burstbucker could plus it had a tone that was both fatter and clearer.

My Hamer is a chambered body guitar so it's more resonant than a Les Paul, and when we compared the Custom Custom in my Hamer to the Burstbucker bridge in my buddy's Les Paul even he had to say about the Custom Custom: "Wow! That might be the best one right there!" And it was.

Lew

[kmcguitars]

I just play my Buddy's new LP with a Burstbucker 2 . I was very Impressed
with the tone. I'd rate it as cross bettween a Seth & Pearly Gates. It was
smooth and sweet with a hint of aggresive. I only played it for 5 minutes
tho. Thru my Princeton. I would have liked to run the gauntlet with it.
To see what it really can do. The guy who owns the guitar Plays in a
very heavy band useing a Marshall 1/2 stack (DSL 100 I think?) he gets
a great contempary sound.

[Jokke]

Hi,

It would be interesting to know what that magazine told about SD Antiquitys. Grams, can you translate that also?

Thanks,
Jokke

[Swansong78]

Well i have to say that after going to the link that grams provided i definently now have a better idea of the differences between burstbuckers and the lovers. I can definently hear more "airyness" coming through as well as a more complex midrange. Although for the time being i think i'm just going to say no to GAS and stay with my burstbuckers. Thanks for all of your help guys, the sound samples were really really helpful. I'll probably eventually end up just buying two more les pauls and throwing a set of seth lovers in one and a set of antiquitys in the other.

Thanks,

Tony

[Jeffrec]

Grams & Simon,

Thanks for the excellent links. I agree with Grams regarding the guys playing, but you do get to compare the subtle tones of each. Hated the DiMarzio's. The '62 PAF wasn;t impressive either. The Duncans were the best of the lot and closest (to my ears anyway) to real PAFs

Jeff

[WITH FULL DISTORTION]

Hails Lew... let me ask you something...
is the neck Seth Lover, too bassy like the 59? is the seth lover neck fatter than the bridge one?
Hails
J.P

[Gearjoneser]

I think I agree with Lew about PAFs. My honeyflame LP Std Prem Plus is a PAF tonemonster with a set of nickel Custom Custom/Seth Lover N. That's my favorite A2 Les Paul combo. My favorite A5 combo is the C-5/59, although my next step is to get slightly overwound C-5's.......then it'll be my favorite Duncan humbucker.

[Lewguitar]

Hails Lew... let me ask you something...
is the neck Seth Lover, too bassy like the 59? is the seth lover neck fatter than the bridge one?
Hails
J.P

I wouldn't say the 59N is to bassy for most people...it seems that most rockers, guys who always play with a little bit or alot of distortion, prefer the 59N to any other pickup.

But the way I play, I like a slightly overdriven tone from the bridge pickup and then a genuinely clear tone when I switch to the neck pickup because I LOVE PLAYING RYTHYM!

The Seth has more mids but less bass than the 59N and even though the 59N is brighter, the Seth lets me get a clearer tone for rythym because the bass stays woof free.

I have declared a WOOF FREE ZONE for the neck pickup of all of my guitars!

You know me: I'm happiest with a Strat neck pickup. That's my fave for rythym.

As far as the neck Seth being fatter than the bridge Seth, I think that's the nature of the neck vs. bridge position more so than the pickup. The bridge Seth is wound like a vintage paf and the neck Seth is underwound a little for better balance with the bridge pickup so it doesn't overpower it like the neck pickup would in a 50's or 60's Gibson and for more clarity.

[Marinblues]

Seth Lover:
- very glassy
- one of the most brilliant sounding pup's in the competition
- nice compression
- not too much bass
- not too fat output
- "open", "breathing" sound
- "Larry Carlton" & "Robben Ford" are associated with this pup
...

that's interesting considering Robben Ford uses Burstbuckers in his Les Paul now.

Marin

[papersoul]

I just play my Buddy's new LP with a Burstbucker 2 . I was very Impressed
with the tone. I'd rate it as cross bettween a Seth & Pearly Gates. It was
smooth and sweet with a hint of aggresive. I only played it for 5 minutes
tho. Thru my Princeton. I would have liked to run the gauntlet with it.
To see what it really can do. The guy who owns the guitar Plays in a
very heavy band useing a Marshall 1/2 stack (DSL 100 I think?) he gets
a great contempary sound.

I completely agree with your statements. I have the Burstbucker Pros in a Les paul Standard and they are rich and creamy with a good bit of aggression. I like the bridge pup with a 300k volume pot and the tone pot rolled to about 8 and man it sounds nice.....not too weak and not too hot. I have tried many replacement pickups but keep coming back for the BB Pros. Gibson did it right. I think the bridge BB Pro is about 8.4k so it is a bit hotter than a '59 or PG and I believe hotter than a Seth. I tried some 9k pups in this guitar but the mids became to prominant and it lost some edge.

[madguitar26]

I have declared a WOOF FREE ZONE for the neck pickup of all of my guitars!

You know me: I'm happiest with a Strat neck pickup. That's my fave for rythym.

As far as the neck Seth being fatter than the bridge Seth, I think that's the nature of the neck vs. bridge position more so than the pickup. The bridge Seth is wound like a vintage paf and the neck Seth is underwound a little for better balance with the bridge pickup so it doesn't overpower it like the neck pickup would in a 50's or 60's Gibson and for more clarity.

same here lew dont like woof on my neck pickups,except for strat.
thats why im going for the seth.
still in doubt about the bridge....cc or BBQ

[papersoul]

Nice thing about the Burstbucker Pro is it can punch as hard or harder than the Pearl Gates or regular BB dues to the Alnico V magnet.

[Zhangliqun]

I've played both extensively, and at least as far as neck pickups go, while I think the Burstbuckers are often terribly under-rated, I like the Seth Lover a little better. Smooooooth is the key word. The response is very even and sweet across the EQ spectrum, but retains the top end sparkle, especially with the cover off.

The 59 has a mid-scoop that tends to make it both boomy and hollow, depending on the guitar you put it in. I think some of this problem with 59's can often be solved with a magnet swap -- I recommend Alnico 4 if you want to keep some of the punch, Alnico 3 if you want it a little softer.

Burstbuckers come in officially 6 varieties from Gibson, regular Burstbucker #1, #2 and #3 (+/-7.6k, 8.1k, 8.7k) and the Burstbucker Pros, which are the same but with an Alnico 5 instead of 2. Tonally, I would say the Burstbuckers are about halfway between the 59 and the Seth. More bite than the Seth, especially with Alnico 5, but less boomy and scooped. As with the 59 above, you can expand the Bursbucker tonal possibilities with more magnet swaps with A3's, A4's and...as soon as they come in...ALNICO EIGHTS.

If Wicked Lester's description of Alnico 8 as a combination of the best of A2, A5 and ceramic is anywhere near accurate, it will be REALLY interesting to hear what any of these pickups sound like with A8! No A5 midscoop and more loose and sweet than ceramic - A2-like - and with output close to ceramic -- that sounds like it has the potential to make the hybrid pickup concept obsolete for the "vintage with balls" formula. Just slap an A8 in a Seth Lover b and VOILA...!