JB NECK model

[rabidrabbit2727]

Magnet type doesn't affect d.c. resistance.

Fo shizzle. btw Evan, the first 4 links in your sig are broken.

[Zhangliqun]

wire gauge is top secret but a common belief here is :
*42 gauge for all paf type from 59 to Demon
*43 for the 14 dc resistance ( customs , full shred )
*44 for the 16 dc resistance ( JB, DD , patb , dime ?)

This belief is extremely likely to be accurate, with the remotely possible exception of the Demon. I wind my own so I know from experience that you can get 5k worth of 42 on a humbucker bobbin (x 2 bobbins = 10k) but you have to wind it fairly neat and tight.

It makes no sense to use anything thinner than 42 for vintage output pickups -- otherwise you get coils that are too thin to pick up enough lows and low mids to sound anything but anemic and mosquito-like.

43 wire is ideal for 12k to a max of 14k. (You can get winds between 10 and 12 if you use 43 on one bobbin and 42 on the other.)

44 wire is ideal for anythign much above 14k.

They do make 45 wire but I bet it's so thin that it might break too often during the winding process to make it cost-effective.

[Zhangliqun]

Magnet type doesn't affect d.c. resistance. So putting a ceramic magnet in a pickup of any type isn't going to give it a "~3k difference." It will affect the tone and output, that's for sure. But it won't change the d.c. resistance.

True.

[Mr 9finger]

They do make 45 wire but I bet it's so thin that it might break too often during the winding process to make it cost-effective.

The WCR "HERC" is wound w/ 48 AWG wire. Your reasoning is probably why they are so dam expensive!

[stangme01]

hey is there a thread or a website with a lamens guide to understanding pickups, like the stuff you are talking about, i understand what you guys are talking about, i'd just like to learn more about what the different guages do for sound, and what the magnet size and type do, what the resistance affects, what compromises there are etc. so i can make more accurate decisions in the future on what to use. and how to achieve certain types of sounds and performance.

[Peterku]

Magnet type doesn't affect d.c. resistance. So putting a ceramic magnet in a pickup of any type isn't going to give it a "~3k difference." It will affect the tone and output, that's for sure. But it won't change the d.c. resistance.

I didn't say that, sorry. I simply meant that an Alnico V pickup needs a hotter wind than a ceramic for a similar application and performance.

[Zerberus]

Thanks for the suggestions guys - but I think you are missing the point: I'm trying to make a JB neck just by swapping the mags. I don't really care about the extra DD. I know MJ can wind anything I can imagine. I still haven't heard anything that says this won't work - although it may not be perfect. I'll take pretty close.

If you mean "Won´t work" in the sense of it will still be a functioning pickup: you are correct.

But if you mean "Won´t work" in a tonal sense...

The Jazz model was specifically made as the neck pickup to go with the JB. It really should be called the JB neck.

Then this is your answer....unless you remove about 6Ks of wire and replace the guage with 42, no chance of getting close

[Aceman]

That's my point! The DD neck is ~3k less wire than the JB. Tonally, I'd like JB. Hot wise, I'd like DD neck. This is for the Middle bucker on a three HB setup. I'd like hotter than Jazz. And, the pup is to compliment either a Jazz neck (JB!) or a Custom (neck pup!) Thus I'm thinkin' JB neck! Which can be made with a DD neck and an a5 mag!!! Yes?!?!!?

[hamerfan]

Hi Zhang, a german winder (David Barfuss) put 5.5k with 42 AWG for me on the bobins. A nasty 11k pup which needed one of your A8 to get alive!
Thanks again!

[Peterku]

The DD neck is ~3k less wire than the JB.

Unless both have the same gauge wire, there's no point in comparison. They're even in different positions. I don't know whether they are the same gauge. If the DD neck is a clear-sounding, screaming neck pickup (unlike the Air Norton for instance, which has a rather middy sound in comparison), my guess would be that it's 44 gauge but that's just a guess. The JB is (another guess, based on the Nailbomb) 43 gauge.

Tonally, I'd like JB. Hot wise, I'd like DD neck. (...) I'd like hotter than Jazz. (...) Thus I'm thinkin' JB neck! Which can be made with a DD neck and an a5 mag!!! Yes?!?!!?

Changing the magnet will completely alter both the tone and the output of the pickup. Putting an A5 mag in the DD neck will have a similar effect to converting the Custom to a Custom 5 (the latter two are 43 gauge, though) -- lower output, less and grainier mids, sweeter highs.

Why don't you just trust Seymour's ears and use the pickups in their stock form?

[Jocelyn]

The Jazz model was specifically made as the neck pickup to go with the JB. It really should be called the JB neck.

Scott has hit it the correct way. Thats excatly what I was trying to say.

[Peterku]

You get two pups:
1) A JB "neck" model at 12.7k or so (DD + A5)
2) A Distortion bridge at the usual (JB + ceramic)

If we say the BK Nailbomb (16K Alnico V with coil offset) is similar to the JB, a matching neck pickup that has rich mids, would be something like the Nailbomb neck model, which is 10-11K Alnico V 43 gauge, it's a nice fat neck sound for modern rock leads. If you want lower output and a cleaner sound, the Jazz neck, as others said, is already there.

[fab.regnaut]

I am just wondering if a DD neck with al 5 would be muddy , well sure a different beast than the Jazz neck ! This based on the DC resistance of DDn , but considering that the DDn is bright with not a lot of bass , well , it is worth trying !

[fab.regnaut]

DDn with al5 wouldn't be more muddy than with ceramic ; less low mids ( and mids)

[ArtieToo]

Hey Aceman - I hope I don't sound like I'm "back-pedaling" too much here, but when I first said that the A5 DD lost all of its DD qualities, I was having a "doh" moment. Of course it did. It wasn't a DD anymore. Basically, it smoothed out. It lost some high-end, but didn't seem to lose much lows or midrange. It wasn't "dull", just smooth. I would have called it a nice jazz pup. I was using it with 250k pots at the time, which probably accentuated the "mellow" aspect of it.

I would say that it's definitely worth trying if you have the parts at hand. Its not a bad pup.

On a side note - my DD has since melded with one of Travis' 59's to become a couple of very cool hybrids. More on that later. After Travis gets his back.

Artie