Distortion/Invader Hybrid...Good Idea?

[UsrName]

I'm thinking of cross breeding a Distortion and an Invader that I have. I love the clarity of the DD, but it is a bit trebly in my maple top Ibanez. I also love the thickness of the Invader, but it is not as articulate as the DD.

Also, the DD is not a trembucker, which I'm pretty sure I need, since the neck is pretty damn wide (43mm nut, 58mm last fret). I'm thinking of replacing the DD pole pieces with the Invader hex bolts. I figure this will take care of the improper string spacing, while at the same time cutting the highs a bit.

I'm not entirely sure I should do this though, what do you guys think? Anyone have experience with this sort of thing?

Will this work? Is this recommended? How do I remove the slugs from the DD? Will the hex bolts fit alright in the DD?

Also, should I do the opposite (keep the Invader in and change the hex bolts to regular pole pieces)?

Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[Pierre]

The coils are EXACTLY the same
So all you'd change would be the polepieces
Also, the Invader has more magnets than the DD.

[UsrName]

The coils are EXACTLY the same
So all you'd change would be the polepieces
Also, the Invader has more magnets than the DD.

So, what would the result be if I changed the pole pieces? Also, more magnets means more output, correct? Thanks.

[revolution]

I've wondered about that...putting screws in place of the hexes on an Invader and dropping the pickup low and raise the screws up to the strings.

[UsrName]

I was also thinking of putting the Invader poles on the DD and installing a capacitor to cut some of the highs. Would this help beef up the DD?

[UsrName]

I've wondered about that...putting screws in place of the hexes on an Invader and dropping the pickup low and raise the screws up to the strings.

Actually, the Invader is really close to my strings right now. If I changed to regular pole pieces, it would probably be the perfect height. Maybe allen screws?

[UsrName]

Anyone else?

[Fusion1]

User name I know what you are trying to do and hopefully I can give you my experience with swapping poles on an Invader. The Invader poles can be switched with slugs or regular hex/allen poles from older Dimarzios which are #10 - 32 poles found on pickups like a Super Distortion or a Super III. (NOT THE HEX POLES FROM SAY A FULL SHRED OR A NEWER DIMARZIO LIKE A FRED OR HUMBUCKER FROM HELL they are #5-40 threads)

There is a pretty noticeable difference in tone between the large Invader poles and the regualr hex poles and even more noticeable over the original DD poles (slotted screws).

I think a good hybrid of this type might be the large Invader poles on one coil and the regualr hex poles on the other coil. You'd get the tighter highs of the hex poles and the thicker sound from the Invader poles. I'd also suggest the Invader poles closest to the bridge and the hex poles toward the neck.

On the other hand if you wanted all 12 poles to match you'd have to do a hybrid of 1 Invader coil and the DD coil would have to be the slug coil. Those Invader poles won't work in anything other than a slug coil. Good luck and I hope you take this experiment to help others and I am curious as well.

PS. I myself may have to try an Invader with 12 slugs in place of the hex poles I have tried or the standard button cap hex screws. Someone here mentioned that slugs actually have more mass so would sound louder than a normal slotted screw but I would have to try that to actually believe that.

[BachToRock]

I can confirm Fusion1's comments that the large Invader Hex screws produce a thicker sound in comparison to traditional screws and slugs...

[UsrName]

What do you guys think about putting the Invader screws in the DD? Will it thicken it up a bit and tame some of the highs?

[Fusion1]

UsrName it should tame the highs quite a bit. You'd in effect need 2 DD Slug coils for that, or since the Invader and DD supposedly share the same coils, one of each. Or substitute the magnet arrangement of the DD to the Invader and you'd in effect have a DD with Invader poles. That's the easiest mod to get the effect you're after.

[Danglin' Fury]

Hey before you go through the trouble of disassembling two pickups, try replacing your tone capacitor with a 100 -150 pico-farad cap. That will, in effect, bring out slightly more highs in your Invader and tame the bass so it doesn't mud out. The mids are as thick as ever and it sounds like a cross between an Invader and a Distortion w/o surgery. I own both pups and swap them out extensively but since the cap mod, I don't really need to. 2 cents applied.

[UsrName]

Hey before you go through the trouble of disassembling two pickups, try replacing your tone capacitor with a 100 -150 pico-farad cap. That will, in effect, bring out slightly more highs in your Invader and tame the bass so it doesn't mud out. The mids are as thick as ever and it sounds like a cross between an Invader and a Distortion w/o surgery. I own both pups and swap them out extensively but since the cap mod, I don't really need to. 2 cents applied.

Thanks, I think there is a 330 in there right now, but it's on the volume pot?? What if I just take the cap out completely? I think I'll try this before I disassemble anything. Thanks again.

[frankfalbo]

I think a good hybrid of this type might be the large Invader poles on one coil and the regualr hex poles on the other coil. You'd get the tighter highs of the hex poles and the thicker sound from the Invader poles. I'd also suggest the Invader poles closest to the bridge and the hex poles toward the neck.

I have this right now on a 7-string lap steel I made. The bridge pickup is a Dimarzio with exactly that configuration: Allen poles inward, Invader mushrooms toward the bridge. It was an attempt to get a nastier, grittier sound out of the pickup, and obviously worked. I like the Invader with Allen poles and can't stand it with the mushrooms. Instead of "hybriding" you should do all your experimentation with just the Invader IMO. You can pull one or both side magnets. Just remember when you put them back, they oppose the center magnet. Then experiment with one or both rows of allen poles.

All those combinations should give you enough information to ponder, without having to bring in Distortion coils. IMO the slug Distortion coil might as well be the allen pole Invader coil. They're close enough. So the only time you'd need to start hybriding is if you wanted to bring in the screw coil of the Distortion. But even then, if you want to hear a screw/slug Invader, just put the side magnets into the Distortion, and you don't have to do any soldering or coil swapping.

[Fusion1]

Good info from Frank there. Frank I too do prefer the all hex Invader the mushroom (as you call it) pole pieces sounds muddy in everything but maybe a strat (which I have never tried ironically).

[UsrName]

Good info from Frank there. Frank I too do prefer the all hex Invader the mushroom (as you call it) pole pieces sounds muddy in everything but maybe a strat (which I have never tried ironically).

Thanks, coincidentally, I had the Invader in a strat for about 10 years, but I never really listened for "good tone" then. Plus I had ****ty gear then also. It was thick sounding though.

[UsrName]

I do have the original Ibanez v8 that came with the guitar. Would the allen screws from this one work?

[Danglin' Fury]

Is the 330 cap exclusively on the volume or does it link the volume and tone together? If it is on the volume only, take that off and put the 150 pico (or 100 pico) on the tone pot. If it does link the volume and tone pots, just replace the cap with a piece of wirebut still put the 150 pico on the tone pot. You WILL NOT be disappointed. If you need to see how this goes, go to stewmac.com and click on the free info link and go to guitar wiring. It will show you where to put it. I have done this in my basswood Dean ML and it was the smartest thing I did to my Invader. It friggin' RIPS!!!!

[UsrName]

Is the 330 cap exclusively on the volume or does it link the volume and tone together? If it is on the volume only, take that off and put the 150 pico (or 100 pico) on the tone pot. If it does link the volume and tone pots, just replace the cap with a piece of wirebut still put the 150 pico on the tone pot. You WILL NOT be disappointed. If you need to see how this goes, go to stewmac.com and click on the free info link and go to guitar wiring. It will show you where to put it. I have done this in my basswood Dean ML and it was the smartest thing I did to my Invader. It friggin' RIPS!!!!

It's a 331 cap and one leg is one leg is jumpered from the left lead of the
volume pot to the middle lead of the tone pot. Also, there is a cap on the tone pot labeled 223k.??

I'll check out stewmac for further info. Does this mod make the bass "tighter"?

Thanks, I hope this helps.

[UsrName]

What does the cap on the tone and volume pots actually do, and what will removing them altogether change?