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Thread: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

  1. #41
    LoveMachineologist jeremy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    especially in this instance, you dont need to use all the power its got. you can still daisy chain cabs together to run more speakers if you wanted. for any ss power, i think its better to have more than you need. i used to have a qsc rmx5050 which could put out 5000w, never ever needed any where near that but i got a good deal and that thing ran cool, sounded awesome, and never hiccuped no matter what i threw at it

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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    Some clarification needed: is a 700w amp or does it have two "sides "/channels 700w each? I have read as much as I could find and it is not specified that I can see but it s seems like a 1400w amp/700w per channel would be overkill unless you are giging stadiums.

  3. #43
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    I read Boomer's description as 700 watts A SIDE. Holy hell! That is loud! There are lots of players that play big venues, so I can see how that could be used, but for me, the 170 would be plenty. Using a Fractal, it seems like it would be perfect.
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  4. #44
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    Quote Originally Posted by Mincer View Post
    I read Boomer's description as 700 watts A SIDE. Holy hell! That is loud! There are lots of players that play big venues, so I can see how that could be used, but for me, the 170 would be plenty. Using a Fractal, it seems like it would be perfect.
    P
    Yeah that is a bunch of power. So you throw your 700 X 2 in a backpack, rent a u-haul, load up your 4 4X12 speaker cabinets and head off to the gig.
    Does it have some sort of limiter in it so you don't end up like Marty McFly?

  5. #45
    Mojo's Minions Lewguitar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    Quote Originally Posted by EAProwlerB View Post
    If what you say is true for the Fender Mustang then logically it would have to be true fore the marshal code, Line 6 AmpliFi/Spider, Blackstar ID: Core, a Vamp 2 plugged into a 100W Chinese power amp (total cost $35+$7, includes pedal and carrying case)...This doesn't work for me. Each of these will allow you to tweak and create 100s of sounds but nothing to my ears as beautiful as a Twin Reverb,
    The $325 Mustang III sounds better than the more expensive Line 6 amps I compared it to.

    I went looking for a Line 6 and after a few days of trying amps, I bought the Mustang.

    If you want the one, exact tone (and back breaking weight!) of a Twin Reverb get a Twin.

    If you want to create your own great tones, get a great modeler and create your own presets based on the amp models and your own idea of what great tone is.

    I pretty much discarded the 80 factory provided presets (they're just to show you what the amp can do...) and just kept the 20 amp models to use as platforms for creating my own tones.

    Then I saved my own presets where the useless, effects drenched, factory presets 1 - 80 were located.

    The days of tube guitar amps are numbered.

    Won't be long.

    A decade or two and they'll be as passe' as Mandolin Orchestras.
    Last edited by Lewguitar; 04-13-2017 at 12:55 PM.
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  6. #46
    LoveMachineologist jeremy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    Quote Originally Posted by Mincer View Post
    I read Boomer's description as 700 watts A SIDE. Holy hell! That is loud! There are lots of players that play big venues, so I can see how that could be used, but for me, the 170 would be plenty. Using a Fractal, it seems like it would be perfect.
    Quote Originally Posted by EAProwlerB View Post
    P
    Yeah that is a bunch of power. So you throw your 700 X 2 in a backpack, rent a u-haul, load up your 4 4X12 speaker cabinets and head off to the gig.
    Does it have some sort of limiter in it so you don't end up like Marty McFly?
    700w @ 4ohms, 350w @ 8 ohms, maybe 200w @ 16 ohms. yes its a lot of power but its really not that crazy. thats full power not clean tube power where a 50w marshall actually puts out 90w when cranked. again, these amps dont like to get hot and when they do they shutdown. a 700w amp is going to run cooler putting out X amount of power than a 250w amp, makes sense to have more power than you need to me

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    Mojo's Minions Sirion's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    This is as good a time to introduce a question that I've had for some time: are there any good wattage readers on the market? As said I use a smallish-size stereo rig with a solid state power amp going into Greenbacks (I've found nothing else that gets the top end just right) and getting a power amp with just the right amount of power probably isn't going to happen. Are there therefore any convenient tools that let me see how hard I am driving the speakers? I've found the tool below, but they refuse to ship outside of America.

    http://zerocapcable.com/?page_id=221

  8. #48
    Mojo's Minions Sirion's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    Quote Originally Posted by jeremy View Post
    700w @ 4ohms, 350w @ 8 ohms, maybe 200w @ 16 ohms. yes its a lot of power but its really not that crazy. thats full power not clean tube power where a 50w marshall actually puts out 90w when cranked. again, these amps dont like to get hot and when they do they shutdown. a 700w amp is going to run cooler putting out X amount of power than a 250w amp, makes sense to have more power than you need to me
    True. I wonder, though, how usable 700 watts are when there is only one output for either side. Traditionally larger power amps had two, so that two 8 ohm cabinets could be added. 700 watts would theoretically be enough to blow up a 4x12 of Celestion's strongest speakers, the Redbacks!

    But I agree: for solid state it makes sense to have too much power, at least as long as one does not rely on speaker breakup, which again leads me to the question above.
    Last edited by Sirion; 04-13-2017 at 01:28 PM.

  9. #49
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    almost all my cabinets have two jacks in parallel, i think its fairly common but maybe theres companies out there that dont do that. as far as speaker breakup, you can run speakers hard and get breakup but usually they will let you know if you are hitting them too hard by sounding ugly so you can back off the volume till they sweeten up.

  10. #50
    Mojo's Minions Sirion's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    Quote Originally Posted by jeremy View Post
    almost all my cabinets have two jacks in parallel, i think its fairly common but maybe theres companies out there that dont do that. as far as speaker breakup, you can run speakers hard and get breakup but usually they will let you know if you are hitting them too hard by sounding ugly so you can back off the volume till they sweeten up.
    Really? I don't think I've ever seen a cabinet like that! Who makes them? Regarding hitting speakers hard, that sounds like it could get expensive quick!

  11. #51
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    ampeg, avatar, and mesa. but now that i think about it all my 4x12 marshalls always had either one jack or the jack plate with stereo/mono. i havent used 4x12s i a long time

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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    Quote Originally Posted by Lewguitar View Post
    The $325 Mustang III sounds better than the more expensive Line 6 amps I compared it to.

    I went looking for a Line 6 and after a few days of trying amps, I bought the Mustang.

    If you want the one, exact tone (and back breaking weight!) of a Twin Reverb get a Twin.

    If you want to create your own great tones, get a great modeler and create your own presets based on the amp models and your own idea of what great tone is.

    I pretty much discarded the 80 factory provided presets (they're just to show you what the amp can do...) and just kept the 20 amp models to use as platforms for creating my own tones.

    Then I saved my own presets where the useless, effects drenched, factory presets 1 - 80 were located.

    The days of tube guitar amps are numbered.

    Won't be long.

    A decade or two and they'll be as passe' as Mandolin Orchestras.
    I have a little 6V6 amp that I use at home and prefer it far over any SS tone I have ever heard.

    If I do gig, which I don't like and only do rarely, I use a Boss Katana 50 or a Boss GT-001 plugged into something bigger if necessary. The tone works for a gig or two now and then but I would prefer my ugly little 6v6 mic'd.

    I understand your selectivity with the Mustang tone creation and selection. I have eight on my Boss GT-001 four that I use most frequently. I spent a lot of time tweaking to get to where they were acceptable. The Katana I just use the Brown channel wide open and get my tone with the guitar volume and tone controls.

    I can't argue that technology will someday create an accurate tube model. The tube amps days being numbered is questionable. I think there will always be purists who will prefer the magic of a tube. Look at the resurgence of tube amps in the high end home audio world. Just when we thought the tubes were a thing of the past they come back, the same is true with vinyl. Who would have thought kids today would be abandoning their MP3s and go looking for vinyl?

    And I would still like to know if the PowerStge 700 is 700w or two 700w channels for a total of 1400w?

  13. #53
    Mojo's Minions Sirion's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    Quote Originally Posted by jeremy View Post
    ampeg, avatar, and mesa. but now that i think about it all my 4x12 marshalls always had either one jack or the jack plate with stereo/mono. i havent used 4x12s i a long time
    I wasn't aware that Avatar offered that. Cool!

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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    Quote Originally Posted by EAProwlerB View Post
    Some clarification needed: is a 700w amp or does it have two "sides "/channels 700w each? I have read as much as I could find and it is not specified that I can see but it s seems like a 1400w amp/700w per channel would be overkill unless you are giging stadiums.
    Go read at the link Mincer provided and other posts. This has all been answered.
    Tech Specs

    • Level: 0 dB to 47 dB
    • Treble control: +/- 13 dB @6.61 kHz
    • Mid control: +/- 13 dB @712 Hz
    • Bass control: +/- 13 dB @87 Hz


    • Output Impedance: 4-8 Ohms
    • Power: 350 W at 8 Ohms, 700 W at 4 Ohms
    • Dimensions: 11.5” x 2.2” x 6.9”
    • Weight: 6.3 lbs

  15. #55
    Gear Ho Gearjoneser's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    It all sounds so very exciting on paper. This isn't my first decade of listening to SS advertising. LOL

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    There's a reason good tube amps cost $700 - $5,000, while SS amps sit around $100 -$450. Like old VCR's, they go in the trash when they break.

    Most serious players and aficionados of great guitar amplification are reading this thread and trying to remain polite.
    Last edited by Gearjoneser; 04-14-2017 at 07:52 AM.
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  16. #56
    Mojo's Minions Sirion's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    Could you please tell me where you got a JC-120 for 450$? Asking for a friend.

  17. #57
    LoveMachineologist jeremy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    ive seen them used as low as $300 in the past year or two.

  18. #58
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    Price does not equal value. There are both solid state and tube amps that range in price and quality.

    People pay ridiculous amounts of money for 50s and 60s Teles and Strats. Me personally, I will take my Warmoth and Musikraft builds over them for my playing. Yes, a 50s Tele is priced exponentially more than my builds, but even if I could afford an old Tele I would take my roasted ash with roasted qs maple and ss frets with a v profile and 9.5" radius...because that is what works for me.

    An original Dumble is the price of a house in some places, but does that mean it is the best amp for every genre?

  19. #59
    Sock Supplier to RHCP Beer$'s Avatar
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    My favourite power amp is my ADA Microtube. It has a real tube presence circuit, is very loud, clean, warm and sounds ideal in the mix. If that ever goes down, I have my Crate Powerblock. It was the first fully functioning amp head to be as small as it is and is a perfectly passable 150 watt power amp of clean, Class D power. I am very interested in that 700W SD power amp considering it takes up less than 1U of rack space. All I'd want to determine is if it sounds as good as the ADA and how good the "Tru Cab Circuitry" sounds. What makes it tru? Is it somehow more convincing than most very unconvincing emulated line outs?

    Directing back to Quilter. They sound great for blues, rock, jazz etc. from what I've heard, but are they capable of the chunk, tightness and compression of a hi-gain tube amp for metal without being left wanting? I haven't heard any Quilter demos exploring that style. The Aviator Gold head is described as having a deeper, chunkier distortion on the Quilter page. I reckon the head version into a decent cabinet with the right speakers might be up to the challenge.
    Last edited by Beer$; 04-14-2017 at 09:13 PM.
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    Mojo's Minions Sirion's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tube Amp Snobbery Apology

    Quote Originally Posted by jeremy View Post
    ive seen them used as low as $300 in the past year or two.
    But as we were told solid state amps go in the thrash when they break, so why would anybody buy one used? </sarcasm>

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