Results 1 to 10 of 10

Thread: Mids and mixing

  1. #1
    Super Toneologist Coma's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    1,463

    Default Mids and mixing

    Is there a tangible difference between lowering bass and treble instead of boosting mids in a track? Is there any reason to pick one over the other? I'm thinking primarily of guitar tracks.
    --------------------------------------------------------
    1973 Aria 551
    1984 Larrivee RS-4 w/ EMG SA/SA/89
    1989 Charvel 750 XL w/ DMZ Tone Zone & Air Norton
    1990's noname crap-o-caster plywood P/J Bass
    1991 Heartfield Elan III w/ DMZ mystery pups
    1995 Aria Pro II TA-65
    2001 Gibson Les Paul Gothic w/ PG-1 & SH-8

  2. #2
    Mojo's Minions Gtrjunior's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    Wherever you go, there you are.
    Posts
    5,770

    Default Re: Mids and mixing

    What you describe is usually how I do it.
    Iíll lower bass/treble...my thinking is that I donít want the guitar fighting the bass for the lower frequencies (bass will always win that fight) and conversely you donít want to bury cymbals etc that reside in the high frequencies.

    You can always adjust the mids to taste once youíve got the guitar settled into the proper frequency range.


    Thatís my thought process anyway.

  3. #3
    PenultimateTone Member Demanic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Phoenix area.
    Age
    52
    Posts
    14,265

    Default Re: Mids and mixing

    You are better off lowering frequencies because as you add tracks together the frequencies off each track add together cumulatively. You might not have too much bass or treble or mids in any individual track, but you could wind up with too much of any of them in the total mix.

    Sent from my Alcatel_5044C using Tapatalk

  4. #4
    Administrator Mincer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Tampa Bay area, Florida, USA
    Posts
    22,214

    Default Re: Mids and mixing

    I think you'd end up with better dynamic range (if that sort of stuff is important to you) by lowering frequencies on either side. You won't digitally clip, either. That being said, some people like to slam it right to the red all the time, but I don't like those types of mixes.
    Dave, Ambassador/Writer/Artist for Seymour Duncan

    My Guitar, Gear, and Music Webpage

    Gear pics and more on my Instagram.

  5. #5
    Darkness on the edge of Tone TwilightOdyssey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    NYC
    Age
    10
    Posts
    12,673

    Default Re: Mids and mixing

    Either additive or subtractive EQ will work.

    The main considerations when EQ'ing are:

    1. Gain. When you use additive EQ you are adding a significant amount of gain; you have to be careful that the EQ'd track doesn't end up louder than the original, so some trim will probably have to be applied. That being said, don't be afraid to get extreme with the EQ to make something fit. Try to avoid listening to tracks solo'd when EQ'ing; that way, madness lies...

    2. Phase. When using either additive or subtractive EQ, there is usually a bump in the frequency response at the cutoff point; this can create phasing artifacts ... you will want to set the EQ point accordingly. (You could also use a 'linear phase' EQ to eliminate this from happening)

    3. Q. Generally speaking, you want to use a wide Q for adding and a narrow Q for subtracting. This applies to hi/low pass filtering as well.

    4. Masking. If you are having trouble getting track A to fit, you can try finding the main frequency of that track and subtract it from every other track.

    5. "Stuck Fader". A sure sign that you need EQ is when you have a track which has good level but in the mix it simultaneously sounds too loud and too quiet.

    6. HPF. Use high pass filtering on every track. Yes, every track.

    6. Know Your Room. Use reference tracks often to make sure that what you are hearing as an EQ issue isn't your crappy room causing an issue.

    As to which is one is actually needed for a mix, a cool trick is to try the 'pink noise' mixing method. If you are having trouble fitting the track onto the pink noise, you may have to add a couple of dB of EQ. Subjectively speaking, and especially with frequency masking, subtractive EQ is not necessarily the best way to get something to fit.
    Last edited by TwilightOdyssey; 07-20-2018 at 07:38 AM.
    Why don't you take your little Cobra Kais and get outta here?!
    My collaborative PROGRESSIVE ROCK PROJECT, As Follows.
    FACEBOOK page for As Follows.

  6. #6
    Super Toneologist Coma's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    1,463

    Default Re: Mids and mixing

    What is pink noise?

    Skickat frŚn min SM-G955F via Tapatalk
    --------------------------------------------------------
    1973 Aria 551
    1984 Larrivee RS-4 w/ EMG SA/SA/89
    1989 Charvel 750 XL w/ DMZ Tone Zone & Air Norton
    1990's noname crap-o-caster plywood P/J Bass
    1991 Heartfield Elan III w/ DMZ mystery pups
    1995 Aria Pro II TA-65
    2001 Gibson Les Paul Gothic w/ PG-1 & SH-8

  7. #7
    Darkness on the edge of Tone TwilightOdyssey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    NYC
    Age
    10
    Posts
    12,673

    Default Re: Mids and mixing

    Quote Originally Posted by Coma View Post
    What is pink noise?

    Skickat frŚn min SM-G955F via Tapatalk
    There are several different kinds of of 'flavour' of noise. The two most common/popular are white and pink. The colour refers to the spectral content of the noise.

    PINK NOISE has a spectral content that closely resembles the way the human ear perceives pitch.

    Pink Noise Mixing is when you set up pink noise at a certain level (I usually use it around -20dBu) and then slowly raise one track at a time until it is barely audible above the noise. The natural way our ears hear frequencies will give you a surprisingly complete sounding mix in a very short time (minutes, as opposed to hours or days).

    Pink Noise Mixing is a great way to set up a 'flash mix' for a client when you are pressed for time. Just add a healthy dose of L2 to your 2-bus when done and send it out as a rough!

    Hope you find this helpful. It's well worth the time to do some research into pink noise, psychoacoustics, and pink noise mixing techniques.
    Last edited by TwilightOdyssey; 07-20-2018 at 07:37 AM.
    Why don't you take your little Cobra Kais and get outta here?!
    My collaborative PROGRESSIVE ROCK PROJECT, As Follows.
    FACEBOOK page for As Follows.

  8. #8
    Mojo's Minions Gtrjunior's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    Wherever you go, there you are.
    Posts
    5,770

    Default Mids and mixing

    Quote Originally Posted by TwilightOdyssey View Post
    There are several different kinds of of 'flavour' of noise. The two most common/popular are white and pink. The colour refers to the spectral content of the noise.

    PINK NOISE has a spectral content that closely resembles the way the human ear perceives pitch.

    Pink Noise Mixing is when you set up pink noise at a certain level (I usually use it around -20dBu) and then slowly raise one track at a time until it is barely audible above the noise. The natural way our ears hear frequencies will give you a surprisingly complete sounding mix in a very short time (minutes, as opposed to hours or days).

    Pink Noise Mixing is a great way to set up a 'flash mix' for a client when you are pressed for time. Just add a healthy dose of L2 to your 2-bus when done and send it out as a rough!

    Hope you find this helpful. It's well worth the time to do some research into pink noise, psychoacoustics, and pink noise mixing techniques.
    It would be fun and enlightening to sit it on a mix and watch you do this.
    Even though I understand the definition I think the actual doing of this type of mix would be quite the learning experience.
    Last edited by Gtrjunior; 07-21-2018 at 04:23 AM.

  9. #9
    Darkness on the edge of Tone TwilightOdyssey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    NYC
    Age
    10
    Posts
    12,673

    Default Re: Mids and mixing

    There are a lot of videos on YouTube both for and against. This one explains the process well, but for everyone that loves using pink noise, another guy hates it. It’s very much a YMMV thing. Even if you try it and HATE it, it’s super helpful to get you to listen critically and objectively and (perhaps most important) develop your own tastes and preferences.

    Why don't you take your little Cobra Kais and get outta here?!
    My collaborative PROGRESSIVE ROCK PROJECT, As Follows.
    FACEBOOK page for As Follows.

  10. #10
    Mojo's Minions beaubrummels's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    The dude abides
    Age
    54
    Posts
    7,755

    Default Re: Mids and mixing

    I second everything TO said with two additions:

    Whether additive or subtractive also depends on the quality of the equipment. Some devices are musical and/or transparent with gain and the mix benefits. Other devices when pushed just sound like a blanket on the sound - so filtered itís like listening from outside the house through an open window. Same goes for subtractive techniques: with certain gear it can just sound like a blanket over the original sound.

    Iíd be careful with pink noise and be sure to keep at or below the -20dbm like TO said. Louder and it slams the speakers with all the frequencies. I witnessed the cone surround of the bass drivers of studio monitors come apart one time when pink noise was sent into them at near unity. Granted they were old and probably needed to be reconed soon, but that sure hastened the process. Kind of expensive mistake.
    Quote Originally Posted by Demanic
    Incompetence is widespread in a world that rewards mediocrity while punishing excellence.
    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarFanatic
    I am currently using Skullcandy headphones I found in the garbage.
    I did find the DS-1 in the garbage.
    I once found a guitar amp in the garbage, a Peavey Studio 110. It caught fire at the first gig I played it at.. But it was at the end of it, thank god.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •